It is important that we know true joy, and it's important that we repeat the right things.
These lyrics begin with: "Joy to the world, the Lord is come!"
And some of the greatest joy is listening to children laugh and play ...and it is something we would never wish to end, even as they grow older.
So, we want them to know real joy ...an everlasting joy.
Yet, how do we bring that joy from day to day when reality becomes painful??
The answer is not simple, yet it is.
Let's say, it is not always easy ...yet, to believe in it is.
The answer is: We give them hope ...a hope that is real, not a false hope.
Not an over-inflated promise.
Not a denial of their own reality that they live and feel.
Not just a few breaths of good intentions.
But, with the breath of confidence that sees another leave their corner of the world to concern themselves with those who have not the same ease of life. And being convincing enough not to be viewed as mere charity ...more inclined to satisfy the giver of charity than those in need. God genuinely cares, and to be convincing ...we too must be genuine enough for them to believe we value their salvation above all, but also their present level of comfort.
A pilot, the 'ace' of the airways, dodges the enemy as he penetrates past hostile fortifications ...aiming not his artillery, but to reach the people with the Gospel message he feels they so desperately need.
We all need it desperately ...and need to be continually fed, but we also need to feed others. They are in need of food and water, but they also need to be fed hope.
The pilot has been doing this so long, it is the most natural, meaningful, and rewarding thing he has ever done ...telling them about Jesus.
Yet, two other things are also on his mind. As always, he must convince them and equip them with the courage and determination to tell others what he has taught them. He must teach them not only about Jesus, but help train them with the techniques with which to tell others.
And he is getting old ...and must train someone to do with he has done for so many years.
He knows that some day he won't be able to fly as he has, yet others shall mount up on eagle's wings.
He knows that some day his mind will diminish ...but what he has taught others will not.
If he teaches them well, one day when he passes away, that which he has taught others ...will not diminish, nor pass away.
Like a mustard seed is small, and can lead to a much bigger thing ...so can our seemingly small efforts.
We may not see how our small things can lead to big things ...but, God sees.
An army officer may have his men dig ditches ...then fill them back up. We may not see the significance of that, but his men do.
They are being taught discipline.
Discipline involves obedience (withstanding even the crafty lure of a serpent ...as Adam & Eve experienced).
Discipline is critical on the battlefield, and it saves lives.
No person on earth is exempt from the battle that is being waged for each and every one of our lives.
The wages of sin, which we all are part of, is death.
But, Jesus takes care of the wages of those who come to Him.
Jesus went to the cross to be crucified as our payment.
That may not seem like a joyous thing ...but, relief is joy for those who had no hope, and salvation is joy for those who've tasted death.
And the life that cries out ...finds joy in the eternal hope of eternal life.
also ...(http://doweneedtoemphasize.blogspot.com/), & though I liked the ending above, I could find no place to store my other repetitive thoughts.
L L
L L
L L
L L
L L L
L L L
L
L
L oo o v v e e e
L o o o v v v e e e
L o o v v e e e e
L o o v v e e
L o o v v e e
L L L o o v v e e e
L L L
L L L L
L L L
L L L L
We know many
of the answers to the questions of the pandemic: What, Where, & Why ...but,
not When it will be over. With Jesus, we know when ...nearly 2000 years ago; Calvary is the answer to 'where'; crucified is 'what'
they did to Him; and we know most of 'why' they did it. And I think most of us
know 'why' He allowed it, when we know He could have stopped it ...yes, to die
for our sins. We could ask why again ...why did He die for our sins??
Because He loves us!!
There are many 'why's and 'what if's in our lives. Why couldn't God just put us in Heaven? Wouldn't most of us know better now, to not do things like eat the fruit off the tree when we're asked not to??
Because He loves us!!
There are many 'why's and 'what if's in our lives. Why couldn't God just put us in Heaven? Wouldn't most of us know better now, to not do things like eat the fruit off the tree when we're asked not to??
No, we all sin
and fall short of the glory of God.
Politically,
if we just spend more money on education and give everyone a job ...a job that
they like, and one that's easy …that would do it, right?? Wouldn't everyone be
good if the environment they lived in was good (and I don't just mean clean
water & clean air)?
Yes, the way
we are brought up and are allowed to grow matters tremendously ...but, with a
great environment, one third did not go the right way. I'm speaking of the
angels ...how could that large a percent go so wrong when they had so much??
Well, a large percentage of us could go wrong too. Education is important, but
sadly negligible if not including God. And our environment needs to be clean
...with at least attempts to make it morally clean. Evolution with its
'survival of the fittest' is without compassion & hope, without true
purpose, and riddled with misdirection. Our heavenly Father watched as His Son
was tortured and crucified ...willingly, so there could be a righteous
separation. So there could be a place where goodness did not have to share an
orb with wickedness. If we want to follow God into eternity, shouldn't we
sincerely choose and attempt to follow Him on earth??? So many questions
...yet, the answer is 'Jesus' for our blessed hope.
Genesis 1:27 --“ …male and female created He them.”
Genesis 1:29 ---And God said, Behold I have given you every
herb bearing seed which is upon the face of the earth, and every tree, in which
is the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.
Genesis 2:15 ---And God took the man, and put him in the garden.
Genesis 2:17 ---the man is told not to eat the fruit from the
tree of knowledge of good & evil, or he will surely die.
Genesis 2:19 ---And God brought the animals to Adam to see what he would name them.
Genesis 2:23 ---“ …she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of man.”
Genesis 2:24 ---therefore a man shall leave his father and
mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and the two shall be one flesh.
Genesis 3:15 ---“ …enmity between you and the woman, and
between your seed and her seed.”
Genesis 3:20 ---Adam called his wife Eve …because she was the mother of all living; 3:22 ---man knows good & evil, so now, so he doesn’t
take and eat of the tree of life and live
forever; 3:23 ---God sent them out from the garden. Where does the tree of
life appear next?
(When God was sending them out from the garden, it was also
said that God provided a covering/clothes.
How much did they understand at this point? They understood the husband/wife part of 2:24;
a covering shows a redemption and perhaps a hope that God is providing, still
working with them and guiding them. All
hope was not lost, was it? Did they
understand the difference between the death of sin, yet the life of hope? Did God only give direction not to eat the
one fruit, then gave them no more direction …except the direction out of the
garden?)
If you not yet read my reasons, I must say I believe there is
good reason to believe that in the first Chapter of Genesis, when it says God
created male and female humans, in His image (verse 27), and said they could
eat from all the trees …that God created many men and women
outside the garden, and He also created Adam outside the garden. I believe it is not going too far to think
this. Suppose when the animals were
created that it mentioned ‘dogs’, then God could have formed Lassie in a
special way and placed her in the garden. God formed Adam, and put him in the garden …as a special
consideration, and gave him a restriction that was not given to the others, to
not eat the fruit of one tree.
And it doesn’t take too much thought to think that God’s
expectation for Adam & Eve when they were sent from the garden, was to tell
the others outside the garden there …to tell them about God, how they were given
a place of paradise, but through their own misguided emotions they were sent
out from that paradise …yet, there is a paradise waiting for all who
believe. Yes, that may be a stretch, but
that has always been God’s goal, for us to tell others. The great commission given by Jesus to the
apostles, was for them to go and tell others about Him. Of course, it we seem more effective to tell
people who’ve clearly seen sin all around them, that Someone loved them so much
that He died for them. The message of
Adam & Eve saying they messed up once and were thrown out, may not be as
effective. Much was to be learned. And perhaps it was a bit difficult for sons
and daughters to find suitable spouses from an unbelieving group, so …anyway,
let’s go to the horrific tragedy of Cain killing Abel.
Genesis 4:1 ---says Adam had relations with his wife, and
that’s talking about Cain being born. It
is very understandable to think Adam and Eve perhaps didn’t want to have
children for some time after that horrific event of one son killing the
other. Down in verse 25, it says and
Adam had relations with his wife again ---and Seth was born. Yet, how much hope
did Adam and Eve really have? And how
difficult would it even be to interact with other people? Perhaps it took some time for Seth to find a
wife, perhaps near 100 years …yet, at age 105, we see that Seth had a son. When Seth found a wife, perhaps Adam and Eve
waited to see how that would work, maybe not celebrating too much inwardly. Yet, when that son of their own son was born
---the appearance of a grandson --- what joy that likely brought! We know how we feel when a grandson or
granddaughter is born. And besides, what
tells me that it happened in this case also …well, it says in Genesis 4:26,
that then men began to call upon the name of the Lord.
Adam & Eve sent out from the garden, then one of their
sons kills the other …it wouldn’t be hard to understand their not telling
others about God, when they couldn’t even feel it within themselves.
Now, many of you many think I am mentioning things that are
not true …so, let me make a few points at this time:
An argument from incredulity is if I say something is false
(not agreeing with what so many others believe) because it contradicts my
personal expectations, beliefs, or because it’s difficult to imagine. Well, I believe that whatever God has done I
have no objection to …it is that I only perhaps object a little to what others
believe God has done. I have a Pastor
and Assistant pastor who both encourage me to read my own Bible, and I don’t
believe I’m saying anything that is not there …any more or less than others who
have told me differently. And I don’t believe God faults me for being interested
in His Word.
An argument from ignorance is if I say something is true
because it hasn’t been proven false; or something is false because it hasn’t
been proven true. Well, I don’t think
those proofs are the basis of my faith.
Proofs change, God doesn’t.
Around the time of Christopher Columbus, many people thought the world
was flat (some still do), but now we believe the earth is a sphere which
rotates and revolves around the sun.
But, I believe that if God wanted to flatten us, he could. Others may challenge believers in God, asking
for us to prove God exists. I never say,
prove that He doesn’t …though that should be fair, given their challenge.
An argument from authority is if I state my claim by
referring to a respected authority on a topic, and insist that is sufficient
evidence to support my argument. Yes, I
believe evolutionists do this all the time …and I could play the game of “my
dad is stronger than your dad”, or “my authority’s argument is stronger than
your authority’s argument”. I can list
the name of James Tour, who is on the top ten list of scientists in the world
if we are having a conversation about Creation or the evolution of life. And to me, I look to him as a respected
authority. Does that mean you should
respect what he says also? Well, I think
if we are talking science, we should listen to one who knows science. If you don’t know if he knows science …then
listen to him first, before deciding. Yet, Creation is not science, but God
doing.
An argument from silence is if I express my conclusion or
opinion based on the absence of historical documents, rather than their
presence. Yes, I have been accused of
this …yet, this is not what I’m trying to do.
Yes, this is my opinion …and yes, I’m looking at what it says in the
Bible. Am I drawing different
conclusions …yes, I am, but I believe I am not stretching what I read as far as
what I believe has already been stretched too far. The church itself for many years didn’t have
the Bible written in the language people could read, and the leaders seemed to
prefer it that way. They wanted to
interpret it for us, and that is precisely what they did. And they did it in areas that were
advantageous for them to use the argument for silence, they used the argument
from authority, and they assumed we all would have no argument because of our
ignorance.
My stretch is in saying ‘the mother of all living’ was their
understanding of future generations …not so much unlike Abraham being ‘the
father of many nations’ …promised in Genesis 17:4-5. And also it seems clear that they knew about
relationships …’a man leaving his father and mother, and cleaving to his
wife’.
This next discourse is not Biblical:
Adam & Woman ate the fruit, and then rather quickly
panicked.
Woman: Quick, we better hide!”
Adam: I think I heard Him.
Woman: No, that was a squirrel.
Adam: I know He’s here.
Woman: What do you think He’ll say; it’s going to be one of
those …those ‘what-you-call-it’ moments?
Adam: You mean He’s going to say, “I told you so!”?
Woman: No, it was you who told me that …no, He’s probably
going to say we’re going to die now.
Adam: Let’s wait and see.
Woman: So, it’s going to be one of those ‘wait-and-see’
situations? No, He said if we ate the
fruit, we were going to die. We ate it,
now we are going to die!
Adam: Too bad we didn’t think of all this before.
Woman: Well, that talking reptile sounded unbelievable …maybe
we can just say we thought it was Him, mascara-ing …playing a joke on us.
Adam: Mascara-ing …now you’re scaring me. Isn’t mascara something you put around your
eyes?
Woman: Well, that serpent put something on my eyes …made me
imagine something.
Adam: Something that wasn’t there …something imagined. Though something that is there, like too much
mascara …is like mask scare-a whole bunch of people. But, I think you meant masquerading. You are
right though …the joke is on us now, but I don’t think He was joking.
Woman: Neither do I, now …that’s why we are hiding, right?
Then He does speak to them …Adam, Woman, and the reptile. And
they listen closely, but are still a bit confused.
Afterwards woman says to Adam: “He didn’t say anything about
us dying. We are still alive, are we not …does that make any sense?
Adam: I’ll ask Him on our way out.
Woman: No, don’t say anything …maybe He forgot.”
(God doesn’t masquerade or play jokes on us. And He doesn’t forget. But, He forgives. He likely explained that they weren’t just
going to die now. He would give them
hope and show them that they were special …and help them understand true life,
eternal life. Would He also tell them
that the message to the serpent of ‘her seed’ would not be the path to death,
but of ‘living’.
Woman: Did you hear that?
I’m the mother of all living!”
Adam: Yes, Eve.
Eve: I like that name.
Being sent from the garden, can anyone assume that God did
not give them hope and direction? Would
they be explained the hope of eternal life …where they will return to paradise,
also having the tree of life there? But,
with that hope, where would hope go after one son kills the other? Would Eve feel more like the mother of all
that seems not alive? Furthermore,
wouldn’t that explain why hope went underground (literally) with the death of
one son and the banishment of the other?
Could a parent ever get over that?
How long before they could emotional heal somewhat …and have hope with
another son? And even then, how could
they be sure that things would not be right, as was the case with Cain? When Seth eventually married, would that work
out? Well, it seemed a grandson helped
return hope, at which point they again began to call upon the name of God.
? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? more ? ? ? ? ?questions? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
Now, the other stretch (which I’m not on board with) would
require incest. And the answer I hear is
merely about the gene pool being safe back then …as if there were not other
problems with incest. Was incest
monitored or regulated? At what age
would it take place, or did anyone really concern themselves with age
limits? I don’t believe any age would
have been, or has ever been acceptable …but, it helps explain Genesis 6:5, “
…that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil
continually.” But, wouldn’t this all
begin as a result of what God left them no means to avoid? What choice did they have? And God told them to multiply and replenish
the earth.
I accept whichever truth it is, but I see nothing solid to
convince me it was this way. God could
have allowed us to be wild, then in time decide to domesticate us. But, I prefer to believe that God set the
standard first ---a man cleaving to his wife (not sister), and then things went
astray because of sin.
What has led us to believe what we presently believe? I don’t think we can honestly say it is
solely the Bible that has helped form all our beliefs. I have already explored this, but I’m still
on the other point.
The Bible doesn’t say that Cain was already married when he
killed his brother. And to think his
wife (or sister) had to be banished with him.
And yes, it is another stretch to explain why he was afraid someone was
going to kill him. If he was mentally
ill, and thought imaginary people were after him, then Genesis 4:15 makes no
sense …as God wouldn’t play along with a delusion. Cain goes to the land of Nod
But, back to Adam & Eve, when Seth was born it was as if
they had left off with relations with each other of this intimate sort for who
knows how long …and then the word ‘again’ introduces Seth. Yet, it isn’t until Seth’s child, their
grandson, comes along when Seth is 105 years old …that they began to call upon
the name of God.
And if you ignore Eve’s future hope of ‘her seed’, then it’s
difficult to see sons of God marrying daughters of men …and you could miss ‘her
seed’ as being a genealogy line to Jesus with Adam being the first man in the
‘line’ and Jesus the last. Yes, this
very important statement …yes, a statement by God, to the serpent, of her
seed. Adam did contribute, as the first
man …and Jesus, the last man, the One to crush the serpent’s head.
Yes, we’ve had conversations of those on remote tropical
islands with no contact with the outside world who have never heard of the
Bible, or what it says. The Book of
Romans says, 1:20, that there is no excuse.
And Romans 3:23, states that all have sinned, and come short of the
glory of God. Romans 5:12-15, also shows
how sin is always present, whether it is defined or not. Sin is separation from God, and it is sort of
a direction we go. God wants us all to
come to Him, and draws us through His Spirit.
If we don’t acknowledge that leading, we are separating ourselves from
Him …and that is sin.
We all seek
affirmation. Sadly, affirmation often
means agreement …and often agreement brings us to that lofty place high above
mere affirmation, to something even more coveted …acceptance. The sad part
comes in when the agreement is not healthy.
Acceptance should not
be wholly based upon agreement. With
five children, when they were young, I recall the three boys having to sleep in
one bedroom (when I was a child, there were six of us, and the five of us boys
slept in one bedroom, with a triple bunk bed and one double bed). But, back to our three boys, …early on, one
of them didn’t like to be hot, so during the night (instead of shedding the
security blanket) he’d open the window wide.
That was particularly unpopular on a cold winter night …but, thankfully
all the children got along fairly well, and I remember many blankets, quilts,
and comforters as the solution on a winter night ---instead of an argument.
So, we have
acceptance without agreement in a healthy environment. Our son who didn’t like hot, would take a
water bottle on a bike ride or to the ball field …and would drink a portion of
the water, and the rest he’d pour over his head.
But, sometimes not
being in agreement is unhealthy. What if
a young child is told a stove is hot …and he concludes it is only as hot as a
hot summer day. If he’s not quite in
agreement about the stove, what happens to the
‘affirmation-agreement-acceptance’? He
may get ‘a firm’ scolding for not ‘agree’-ing to obey, and you may need the
hospital to ‘accept’ him.
Often we don’t like
the word ‘obey’, and we prefer to think of loving guidance. And many of us judge the controlling parent
that is bent on obedience? Could it be
that at least part of the problem is with the child who is receiving the
instruction, and their attitude towards being taught instruction?
God uses various ways
to deal with us …so, can we clearly see it is not His wisdom and His way which
is the problem, but our failure to accept His way and what He says? Adam & Eve were given the obedience
directive …and Cain was given guidance and instruction by God. Neither worked very well, but it wasn’t God’s
doing …it was their fault, and today it is ours. Cain was likely not ignored by the one who
tempted his mom …and we also have to choose which voice we listen to.
I recall stories that
my parents have told me. Mom tells me of
how her dad did deliveries for a bakery, owned and run by someone in the
family. A man came in to have a cup of
coffee …he couldn’t afford a doughnut because he was going through rough
times. He was given a doughnut anyway,
and a substantial amount of money (whatever substantial was at that time) to
help him get by for the next few weeks.
In return, the gentleman showed his gratitude by giving him a secret
recipe for doughnuts. Every day before
going to work, he would mix up the secret recipe and carry it to work with
him. Everyone said that he had the best
doughnuts they had ever tasted …but, he never told of the secret recipe that he
mixed at home.
Dad also told stories
of how neighbors would all get together for barn raising. And if someone was having difficulty getting
their crops in, everyone would finish up their necessary chores, but before
doing more they would all get together to help the neighbor. Even Grandpa’s dog herded the widow’s cows in
from neighboring fields before herding Grandpa’s cows home.
And though those are
great examples, what about current times?
How about today? Well, every time a disaster or tragedy happens we can
read of great things people do to come to the aid of those most in need. Likewise, with this present pandemic, many
people are doing great things. We should
be especially grateful to the police, firefighters, paramedics, nurses, and
doctors …and I know we could all add more to this list. And yes, we should be thankful for all those
working to supply all of us with our everyday needs.
Yet, in a few months
there will be something happening that doesn’t seem to help us much to work
together. And yes, this is getting back
to the ‘affirmation-agreement-acceptance’.
I’m talking about the political drama in an election year.
The history of
politics is much misunderstood. Near the
mid-19th century we had a party called the Whigs, who were after the
ones who actually wore wigs. Today, the
trend is more to ‘wig out’.
How many people know
that the Democratic-Republican party was one of the first parties in our
country …and the opposition was the Federalists?? The party split late on, and today we mainly
have the two parties. In my lifetime,
there often wasn’t much difference between the political views of the two parties.
When our country was
first founded, the biggest political battle in deciding on the Constitution was
representation …somewhat like it was a problem during their struggle with England
Yes, economics is
often directly related to the concept of ‘big’ …whether big city, big business,
or big shots (common label, though not always fairly). People have always seemed to have an
inclination to represent things unfairly and inaccurately …pardon me, if I’m
doing the same, but it seems the biggest difference between today’s parties is
not what it used to be. The growing
divide has been an issue of morality …or the lack of it.
The emotional impact
of me saying that may not help minimize the divisiveness that seems forever
present. It seems problematic to me that
we view morality much the same as we view truth …ever changing, and what we
want it to be.
I believe in God, and
not evolution. And yes, I don’t just
believe it …as I want to believe it.
But, I’m not satisfied with just that …as I am interested in truth. If you want me to take you on a tour of facts
about the beginnings of life ---well, I can’t do that. But, Mr. Tour can …and a good friend gave me
a link to James Tour’s explanation of life from a scientific point of view,
which sadly most evolutionists fall short on.
I’ll let him take you down that path.
I also watched a video of someone opposing what James Tour said, but it
had no real substance and mostly spent the whole time just ridiculing
senselessly.
I want you to know
that I’m here to also take whatever criticism you want to give. I like the
quote from Margaret Thatcher, 'I
always cheer up immensely if an attack is particularly wounding because I
think, well, if they attack one personally, it means they have not a single
political argument left.'
We will hear many arguments this
election year about how we need to throw money at education, housing, etc. And yes, those are very important, but when
talking about things like education, we are sadly negligible in giving our
children the building blocks needed to grow a person.
I understand why many feel they
should not teach about God in schools, as likely we would be obliged to give
equal time to teach about other gods …to me, false gods. But, in fairness, why
are we teaching false science …in teaching evolution. In order to teach about life, we’d have to
have an extraordinary understanding of the exactness of cell structure and
development.
Hi Bob,
My wife & I were listening to your show today, with your guest Grady
McMurtry. I was politely trying to
listen to my wife’s comments along with what you were both saying, so I don’t
really know what the caller was asking, except that it was about the speed of
light & whether it is constant. So,
I’m guessing it was in reference to how old the stars are with the light
arriving here (maybe way off here, but again, not blaming my wife …she’s very
interesting to listen to also). We both
believe in the Creation being literal 24 hour days, so the Light was day #1,
and the intervals of day & night were already established before the sun
was created. The light did not need to
travel here as it was already here, and we’re talking about God (where science
does not explain God, and is of no use unless it follows the truth of God). So, again, the light was already here, and the
fourth day He created the sun which at that point took over the intervals. I look at it sort of like the computer screen
now before me …it’s right there in front of me, but if I want to save it, I
just ‘minimize’ it by clicking in the upper right hand corner, and it lists
just the title at the bottom of the screen.
In Genesis, I believe the path of the light that was already present on
day one was then ‘minimized’ into stars. There is much more beauty I see in
this, but this is enough for now. Yes,
here I am on Facebook, and I tried to go to Grady’s site here, but it looked
not to be too active. Your site seems to
have been active at least two months ago.
If this is meant to reach you, it will.
God bless you & your family.
Sincerely, Stephen
I am going to
weigh in on it ...and say something. I'm not asking you to share in my feelings
...as you are you & I am me. I was horrified and angry when I first watched
the Georgia Minneapolis
I understand
that we expect we should be able to trust our parents, our school teachers, our
church leaders, medical responders & personnel, and our police ...and when
that expectation is not met, we feel betrayed. Random acts of violence create a
different sort of shock ...but, betrayal is at a different level. Yet, we can't
group people and assume they would all betray us. I believe the good people
outweigh the bad ...and when I was working, I saw the best in the two of you.
(God bless ...as He is whom
we can truly trust, maybe not for all this to be fixed, but for an end to
having to live with it for eternity. And to embrace His common purpose for us
in this life.)
My wife asked what
would happen if they defund the police …what if there was a massive school
shooting, and would they be able to kill every last student?? A young girl is raped …what authorities can
look into it?? Many protesters don’t
want police, but they don’t want surveillance cameras either. Everyone may have an iPhone, but who could
you call if you needed help??
Neighborhoods would arm themselves, and feel they need to be the law
…and that would be much worse.
People deserve to be
angry …but, anger seldom solves problems.
I was in college when
I first got angry over an article I read about a judge letting a young man free
after the young man raped a girl …the man was 19 years old when he committed
the rape, but the judge used a guideline establishing a second chance for any
young man under 18 years of age (which he was not) in any case where the young
man was pursuing or planning to pursue a career in a reputable field. The young man was planning on being a police
officer, so the judge let him free. I
thought, who’d want a police officer whose standards were so low and
unpredictable. I would never want a
person that is suppose to protect others, to be in that position …when he had
so violently hurt another person. And
that has been a reality of which we have way too often seen. Would a person who rapes another, also be
capable of killing others without cause of self-defense??
When Obama was
campaigning for his second term as President, it became a very interesting
debate. Romney, a successful
businessman, was attempting to win the election. Of course, many wanted him to disclose his
taxes. Taxes are something we are very
familiar with …having to list our annual income. Whether considered salary, wages, or earnings
…the average voter seems very interested in the disparity between rich and
poor, and the rich often find themselves defending their earnings.
Obama came out with
one of his famous lines at this time, “You didn’t build that!” He had a point
because, yes, we all know the people working for the successful businessman
help make him successful …and in many ways, the workers build the company or
business.
Okay, I’m leaving
that thought and going way back to a time when I was not here, and not able to
vote. And thankfully, we don’t
contribute with the magnitude of decision-making that we are in no way
qualified to participate in. I’m
speaking of the angels. Decision-making
is not always pleasant, but for God …well, He knows what to decide. And God decided to create the angels first.
Some believers may
say that there are verses that support a different point of view, but I quote
the Book of Job, Chapter 28, where it says the sons of God shouted for joy at
Creation. One of the many points of view
states that the angels shouted for joy on the sixth day. I see it as significant that fish, birds, and
land animals are mentioned in Chapter one, but not angels. In Chapter 2, we see God’s direction to Adam
…not to eat the fruit of one tree. And
quickly, in Chapter 3, we see the serpent tempting Eve with much
deception. I would think the rebellion
of Lucifer, and the recruiting of a third of the angels would take some time
…and would be quite significant, yet it is not mentioned in these first
Chapters.
I’ve worked on some
relatively difficult Math problems, and I enjoy working on Logic problems. The Bible, God’s Word, is not a Math problem
…but, both work with an absolute. And
God does not have to be logical to us ---as He surpasses all understanding
---in love, wisdom, and kindness. If we
read the Bible with the intent to understand it, that is certainly more
beneficial than to choose passages with the intent to point out
inconsistencies.
When I refer to logic
in view of puzzles or problems, the assumption is that there is a
solution. Logically, it stands to reason
that we either believe the Bible is true, or somehow believe it is not. And logically, if we believe it to be true (which
I do believe), then we can’t just use one verse …it should all make sense
together.
Often when doing a
logic puzzle, I may think I have something right …but, if it doesn’t fit
everything together, I have to conclude I have something wrong. For those of you who are more familiar with
Sudoku puzzles, the same principal holds …having some of the numbers listed,
and you may think you know where some of the other numbers go, but you won’t be
sure until you see they all fit. The
numbers used for Sudoku are much easier for me, but the logic puzzles are often
hard to keep everything straight all at once.
Yet, I believe the discipline needed has helped me much in working to
understand certain difficult Bible passages. (It also helps reading other
people’s perspectives.)
I believe ‘sons of
God’ in the Book of Job, refers to the two-thirds who didn’t rebel …and
especially, in the New Testament, it is made clear that we believers are also
‘sons of God’. The Light that we read
about on day #1, is God’s Light …and it’s the Light that will be in the New
Jerusalem (Heaven), though it will not be at intervals in Heaven, as there will
be no night. On day #4, God designated
where light would shine, creating orbs of fire and those that would reflect
that light.
I believe the angelic
rebellion was halted, and removing the light was part of that. (You can’t fight
very easily what you can’t see …and this principal is what I see being used in
the Book of Judges, as God guides Gideon.)
I also know how I felt when the power went out while I was working in the
prison. Not being able to see was not a
comfortable feeling. Thankfully, the
power generators soon came on, and restored the light.
I always felt God
created all the angels at once, and I still favor that point of view. But, we don’t know. And I have another point to make.
Suppose God created
one angel at a time, developing a relationship with each one, and letting them
‘earn’ more status and power (sort of a reward system). And being one of the first, suppose Lucifer
earned the highest status after a while.
(Yes, I did return to that word ‘earn’.)
Having achieved the
highest status, suppose Lucifer wanted to elevate himself even further. However it was and for how long, we don’t
know, but we do know there was a rebellion.
Likewise, we have choices, and our business is clearly before us …we
‘build it’, our relationship with Him.
And we don’t ‘earn’ our salvation.
We can thank Jesus for that.
— — Mao
"To distribute resources evenly will only ruin the Great
Leap Forward. When there is not enough to eat, people starve to death. It is
better to let half of the people die so that the other half can eat their
fill.”
I have a close friend whose daughter was
murdered a number of years ago. She was the manager of a video store, and went
in early to get everything ready. What
she wasn’t ready for, was the man who was about to murder her.
My good friend felt the rage that any of us
would feel. He got a gun, and was driven to kill the man who murdered his
precious daughter.
While he was driving to the man’s house, he got
a call on his phone that the man who murdered his daughter was in custody. It wasn’t the man who he thought it was, and
though he was still angry with rage, he thanked God he didn’t kill an innocent
man.
Yes, he was still angry over the murder of his
daughter …and that takes a lifetime to deal with, but he didn’t burn down the
video store where she’d been murdered.
Nor did he direct his anger towards killing a person of the same race as
the man who murdered his daughter. If he
had done these things, then someone else would be upset and would react …making
it impossible to imagine an end to the chain reaction of destructive responses.
We live in a world where many terrible things
happen every day. Our world is also filled with many wonderful things …though
those things are often not powerful enough to penetrate our grief, or anger.
A true friend will help us through our
difficult times. Others let their anger go beyond themselves …and allow others
to stir the cauldron, then feed them the poison. Those who may have come close
to overcoming their anger, are more angry than they ever have been. And the poison becomes our steady diet.
I ask, “Who benefits from this??”
Revelation 20 King James Version (KJV)
20 “And I saw an
angel come down from heaven, having the key of the bottomless pit and a great
chain in his hand. 2 And he laid hold on the dragon, that
old serpent, which is the Devil, and Satan, and bound him a thousand years, …7 And when the thousand years are
expired, Satan shall be loosed out of his prison, 8 And shall go out to deceive the nations
which are in the four quarters of the earth, …”
Revelation 22 King James Version (KJV)
22 “And he showed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal,
proceeding out of the throne of God and of the Lamb. 2 In the midst of the street of it,
and on either side of the river, was there the tree of life, which bare twelve manner of fruits,
and yielded her fruit every month: and the leaves of the tree were for the
healing of the nations. …11 He that is unjust, let him
be unjust still: and he which is filthy, let him be filthy still: and he that
is righteous, let him be righteous still: and he that is holy, let him be holy
still. 12 And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man
according as his work shall be.”
Our oldest daughter’s
husband received an internship for one year at Johns Hopkins
in Baltimore Baltimore
One group of
politicians have said they’ve given a great deal of money to Baltimore Baltimore
The argument of who
is right could go on forever. And the
most popular argument often is viewed as the most sound …claiming that a
powerful and rich nation should not withhold anything from its people. That is often viewed as a dictatorship in
other parts of the world …or if one political party wants to dominate another,
they may want to mislabel to serve the purpose of advantage.
Whether this argument
is correct, or not …or whether it is a ‘sound’ argument, or not, does not diminish
the ‘sound’ loudly aired by those who protest in view of having the better
perspective on things.
We may claim to know,
but we don’t know …but, God knows. And
perhaps He chose not to institute the better way first …because His wisdom is
in knowing, and knowing that our understanding is flawed and filled with doubt
prone to deception. Don’t we often think that things would turn out better if
they had been different??
Yes, how absurd to
claim that!! But, we often dabble in
absurdities.
Imagining all that
the angels had …what could they have wanted more??
Humans, on the other
hand, had everything they needed …though arguably not everything they
wanted. The serpent deceived them
through means of which he himself failed …discontentment, or desires beyond
what one has. And willing to venture
high risk to obtain it, or perhaps thinking there is no risk at all …a selfish
perspective of not considering how what we want may affect others.
We often don’t know
how much we need God, until we have fallen away. But, if we fall away too often, or too long
…we may not realize it, but our thoughts leave Him, and become influenced and
controlled by others.
Our Constitution was
made only for a moral and religious people.
It is wholly inadequate to the government of any other. ---John Adams,
our 2nd President.
Many people are
saying our nation came about through revolution. Yes, the revolution did happen …our Founding
Fathers wanted to prevent that from happening again.
With the Constitutional Convention going badly and some
delegates leaving in disgust, the elder statesman Ben Franklin, rose to
address the remaining delegates. (George Washington presiding)
I have lived, Sir, a long time, and the longer I live, the
more convincing proofs I see of this truth that God Governs in the affairs
of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice, is
it probable that an empire can rise without His aid?
We have been assured, Sir, in the Sacred Writings, that “except
the Lord build the House, they labor in vain that build it.” [Psalm
127:1a] I firmly believe this; and I also believe that without his
concurring aid we shall succeed in this political building no better than
the Builders of Babel: We shall be divided by our partial local
interests; our projects will be confounded, and we ourselves shall become
a reproach and bye word down to future ages.
And what is worse, mankind may hereafter from this
unfortunate instance, despair of establishing Governments by human wisdom
and leave it to chance, war, and conquest. I therefore beg leave to
move that henceforth prayers imploring the assistance of Heaven, and its
blessing on our deliberations, be held in this Assembly every morning
before we proceed to business, and that one or more of the clergy of this
city be requested to officiate in that service.
He was probably the least religious
of the Founding Fathers calling for prayer and quoting Scripture. Yet, it
was the turning point of the Constitutional Convention.
When did morality begin to
exist for us??
It seems to me that it began right after Adam & Eve ate the forbidden fruit. Whether they felt naked to each other, or if they felt they didn't want God to see them naked ...well, I don't really know. Did they look at each other differently, or look at themselves differently ...or both??
Ethics can be considered a code of conduct generally expected of people within an organization or field of study. Morality, as discussed earlier, does also deal with right or wrong ...yet, in a society which doesn't glorify God, it becomes not so much what is right or wrong, but that which least offends other people.
Morality has much to do with relationships ...those which God chose for us. Animals are not considered immoral, as they do what they do. Adam & Eve were to have roles, and their relationships were designated by God ...physically, emotionally, and spiritually.
It seems to me that it began right after Adam & Eve ate the forbidden fruit. Whether they felt naked to each other, or if they felt they didn't want God to see them naked ...well, I don't really know. Did they look at each other differently, or look at themselves differently ...or both??
Ethics can be considered a code of conduct generally expected of people within an organization or field of study. Morality, as discussed earlier, does also deal with right or wrong ...yet, in a society which doesn't glorify God, it becomes not so much what is right or wrong, but that which least offends other people.
Morality has much to do with relationships ...those which God chose for us. Animals are not considered immoral, as they do what they do. Adam & Eve were to have roles, and their relationships were designated by God ...physically, emotionally, and spiritually.
Some animals seem only to
have a physical relationship, but other animals do much better than most of us
humans. Male and female swans have a habit of putting their heads
together, and with their curved necks, they form a heart-shape image. It is not
just an image though, they truly are loyal to one another. And the Emperor
Penguins have many traits among them to be admired. Eagles, otters,
beavers, and angelfish are also very loyal.
One of the most loyal, not only to their mate, but also to their extended family ...is the wolves. But, mostly we don't view them as good, because they eat lambs (as depicted in so many stories, giving young children nightmares).
Dogs can be very loyal to us, but rather indiscriminate towards other dogs. Horses have also demonstrated great loyalty to one owner. And homing pigeons always seem to know where their home is.
One of the most loyal, not only to their mate, but also to their extended family ...is the wolves. But, mostly we don't view them as good, because they eat lambs (as depicted in so many stories, giving young children nightmares).
Dogs can be very loyal to us, but rather indiscriminate towards other dogs. Horses have also demonstrated great loyalty to one owner. And homing pigeons always seem to know where their home is.
Humans were created in the
image of God ...to love their Lord, their God, and love their neighbor as
themselves. Though that often does not happen, that was the way it was
meant to be.
Humans are to have a relationship with God, a family relationship with parents and children, and our relationships with those outside our families.
Adam & Eve realized they were naked, and crudely sewed leaves together ...later, God providing them with coats of skin. We all know that for Cain and Abel to be born, the animal skins had to make way for their own skin ...but, we all see how clothing serves a great purpose. We don't have a problem with a baby running around naked, but not too long, as we would have a huge sanitary problem. They need a diaper. Yet, though we improve much as we grow older, we encounter other changes which necessitate good sanitary conditions to continue with some sort of clothing in our pelvic area, anterior and posterior. There are other good reasons not to go around naked, but I am not going to continue with that issue. I probably should’ve left this whole part out.
Humans are to have a relationship with God, a family relationship with parents and children, and our relationships with those outside our families.
Adam & Eve realized they were naked, and crudely sewed leaves together ...later, God providing them with coats of skin. We all know that for Cain and Abel to be born, the animal skins had to make way for their own skin ...but, we all see how clothing serves a great purpose. We don't have a problem with a baby running around naked, but not too long, as we would have a huge sanitary problem. They need a diaper. Yet, though we improve much as we grow older, we encounter other changes which necessitate good sanitary conditions to continue with some sort of clothing in our pelvic area, anterior and posterior. There are other good reasons not to go around naked, but I am not going to continue with that issue. I probably should’ve left this whole part out.
When I worked in the
children's division of the Mental Institution, one teenage girl said to me that
if she was a couple years older, she would date me.
I laughed when she said that.
Yet, when I noticed that she appeared hurt, perhaps thinking of her with the
stigma of being mentally ill, I apologized to her by offering an explanation.
I said I was working professionally as an adult role model figure ...and
I looked at, and treated each of them as a parent who cares for their children.
And I told her that if I looked at her as a daughter, the mention of her
thinking of dating me ...well, it ruined that parent/child relationship and was
a bit disturbing to me.
Again I apologized, stating
that I laughed because it made me feel uncomfortable. From that point
forward, she called me 'Dad'.
What do you read into this? And how do you read of Adam & Eve ...and then of Cain and his brother Abel?
What do you read into this? And how do you read of Adam & Eve ...and then of Cain and his brother Abel?
But, before I get into that ...look
at what happens when a man has more than one wife?? The temporary inability to have children
affected Hannah, Rachel, and Sarah. With
Sarah, she was the sole wife while she was alive, yet there was still conflict
with Hagar …who did what she was asked to do. We don't read much about how
Solomon's wives responded to it, but most every other occasion there seems to
be trouble. And we do see that Solomon himself finally learned …reading Ecclesiastes, and Song of Solomon.
God shows us much with relationships.
We are to worship and glorify one triune God ...and we are to have one
spouse, whom we are joined together with as set forth by God. There is
not to be another spouse that could be conceived (whether true or not) to be
getting an unequal amount of our affections.
And with our children, we are to love them equally also. As for their
relationships towards one another ...they are to be brothers and sisters.
I believe that Adam was
outside the Garden of Eden with all the other people (men and women) whom God
created. This is what I actually read in Chapter 2. It says God
formed Adam, then planted the Garden of Eden ...and put Adam in it. I believe that after Adam & Eve were sent
from the Garden of Eden, and Cain, having killed his brother ...he was sent
away, and found a wife among the women created outside the Garden of Eden. Cain
did not kill Abel to compete for their sister. Wives competitively vying
for attention from their husbands is wrong, and imagine how worse if in bitter
competition sisters fought to see who'd marry their brother.
This goes against all the
concepts of God's teaching us about relationships, it is wrong, and it is
immoral. And I believe that all became evident within their spirit when
they ate the forbidden fruit. Morality and relationships are rather
inseparable. Healthy relationships with God give each of us a good moral
society.
Studies have shown that
incest can bring on many disorders. It
is considered sexual abuse.
Dissociative identity disorder (DID),
previously known as multiple
personality disorder (MPD), is a mental disorder characterized by the maintenance of at
least two distinct and relatively enduring personality
states. The illness is accompanied by memory gaps beyond what would be
explained by ordinary forgetfulness. The personality states of mind alternately
show in a person's behavior; presentations,
however, are variable. Other
conditions that often occur in people with DID include posttraumatic stress disorder (PTSD),
personality disorders (especially borderline and avoidant), depression, substance use disorders, conversion
disorder, somatic symptom disorder, eating disorders, OCD, and sleep disorders. Self-harm, self-mutilation, suicide,
impulsivity and rapid changes in interpersonal relationships, non-epileptic
seizures, flashbacks with amnesia for content of flashbacks, and numerous anxiety disorders are also
very common.
Acts of self-mutilation, impulsivity, and rapid changes in interpersonal relationships "may
warrant a concurrent diagnosis of borderline
personality disorder."
Post Traumatic Stress Disorder: The condition may last
months or years, with triggers that can bring back memories of the trauma
accompanied by intense emotional and physical reactions. Symptoms may include nightmares or unwanted
memories of the trauma, avoidance of situations that bring back memories of the
trauma, heightened reactions, anxiety, or depressed mood.
Romans, Chapter 5,
states:
“Therefore, just as
sin entered the world through one man, and death through sin, so also death was
passed on to all men, because all sinned. For sin was in the world before the
Law was given, but sin is not taken into account when there is no law.”
The one man spoken of,
is Adam, but was Adam the first human to sin??
Wasn’t Eve the first to sin?? Or
wouldn’t it at least be more accurate to say all sin came into the world through
Adam & Eve??
Yet, do we technically
know that Eve sinned against God, since we only read that God told Adam not to
eat the forbidden fruit?? She did state
that she was not to eat it, so that makes her more than an accomplice in
sharing with Adam, don’t you think?? And
we all sin, though God does not speak to all of us directly.
The Bible reads that
Eve was not created yet, when God told Adam which fruit was forbidden to
eat. By nature of God’s response to
their eating the fruit, it appears to me that Adam told Eve, not God. So, the sin entered the world through Adam
…as what the Book of Romans seems to be speaking to. And we all have the Bible,
so we are told of the Word of God, we can say God speaks to us through the
Bible …but, His Word is often passed on to us through the witness and testimony
of others. Yes, we get His truth also from listening to others. Eve got God’s message from Adam, and that is
sufficient …and we read how God addressed that.
God spoke to the serpent about the ‘seed’ …and
we see the line (seed) from Adam to Jesus.
Jesus prepared His disciples. He
mentioned the two great commandments: : ‘You
shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and
with all your mind.’ This is the first
and great commandment. And the
second is like unto it, ‘You shall love your neighbor as yourself.’
Before
Jesus came to earth, and also afterwards for people who were never reached with
the Gospel, this knowing of God, and the Golden Rule would seem to apply. Even unbelievers are accountable on many
levels to love your neighbor as yourself. (Also as the Book of Romans, Chapter
one, verse 20 states ---“ …they are without excuse.”)
The Great Commission
is referred to Jesus telling them to make disciples of all nations.
The Apostles told
others about Jesus, and those who heard were held accountable to either accept
what they heard, or reject it.
I don’t think the
administrator of this Group, Creationism’, would mind if I explain my understanding
of Creation. After all, there is much
discussion for and against …mostly from a scientific point of view. God is not confined to science. Science is the order which God gave to the
universe, to help us trust and understand, and also to keep an active mind to
think. Creation does more than imply a
Creator …it insists upon it. God can
make something exist suddenly out of nothing …and that bothers some of us,
especially considering that He can determine whether our existence continues or
not. Someone being presently abused,
likely doesn’t want their present existence to continue …and would wish for a
better existence.
It’s not just wishful
thinking …compassionately, God does not allow our present existence to
continue, where one person’s freedom of choice imposes less than kind treatment
for another. Yes, I’m speaking of an
afterlife. On earth we may be
experiencing some form of bliss, while another person may be in torment. I know there are different forms of
torment. Presently it is summer 2020,
and there is a pandemic affecting people around the world. That is one type of torment. Yet, there is also torment directly and
intentionally incurred because of the uncaring or careless actions of
others. In an afterlife, it would be
nice if neither type of torment existed. And that brings us to a pre-Creation,
where sickness did not exist …only the freedom of choice of individuals
existed.
The individuals I’m
referring to are angels. The angels
existed in one way which many of us look forward to …existing in a realm
prepared by God, experiencing His glorious presence. Most of us would aspire to
such a wonderful existence. Yet, when something is so wonderful and no
experience outside of the wonderfulness …there sometimes comes wonder. And it can be a detrimental wonder, with no
knowledge of what alternate thoughts could evolve into.
An angel committed to
these thoughts, and seemed to thrive on proceeding in that direction, also
energizing other angels with prolific imagination of untested opportunities. Once committed and experiencing the rush of
emotion with gaining followers, there was no vision of turning back. And one third of the angels followed, not
their Creator, but the wayward path.
The Book of Revelation
21:23, states, “The city does not need the sun or the moon to
shine on it, for the glory of God gives it light …” This is the New Jerusalem, or what I believe
is Heaven. I think this would be the Light we read of in Genesis 1:3. And yes, I believe this Light was temporarily
withdrawn when the third of the angels rebelled.
Chapter 7, Book of Judges, quite dramatically shows how under
the cloak of darkness …yes, we see the effective confusion in verse 22.
I worked in a prison, a mental health prison …where they had
much more freedom to move around than in a regular prison, supposedly giving
them the opportunity to learn how to interact.
Yet, old habits and ways die hard, and sometimes the opportunity to
interact with lax supervision brings out a familiar part of their nature which
thrived outside of prison. Often their
behavior has been held in check, not because they’ve been rehabilitated, but
because it is profitable in working towards a shorter incarceration.
Well, one evening the prisoners were roaming about in their
shared area …and we officers were supervising amongst them when the power
suddenly went out. It was not a comforting feeling during those moments,
waiting for the emergency generators to turn on. We quickly located a couple flashlights we
had on hand, and the prisoners were directed to their bedrooms without
incident, yet it would have been a bit difficult to manage an uprising at that
time. Though many of the mentally ill
just want to be left alone, and would welcome being sent to their room …well,
we also realize there are always malingerers pretending to be mentally ill, as
they have more freedom and not have to do the ‘hard time’.
Of course, it may have also been a bit difficult to cause an
effective uprising at that time, as neither could the prisoners see too well
what they were doing. And that is my point …the angel rebellion would have been
difficult with absolutely no light. And
who knows, they could have also been flooded with water. (Ever see a fire hose
disperse an angry crowd?
Not knowing what was going on, it is understandable that when
God said for there to be Light, that a few of them would burst into celebratory
song, and the remaining two-thirds would shout for joy.
Job 38:4-7 reads, “Where
were you when I laid the
foundations of the earth?
Who fixed its measurements? Surely you
know!!
On what were its foundations set,
while the morning stars sang together
and all the sons of God shouted for
joy?”
[Some attribute
the title of ‘morning stars’ to archangels, perhaps leading the singing …and in
response to that leading, the other angels shouted for joy (two-thirds of the
angels, that is).]
I had to drive 61
miles to the prison where I worked.
During Michigan
The angels would soon
see evening, after a set interval of the Light of day. It reminds me of when our family would rent a
movie, pop the popcorn, and nestle together in anticipation of an enjoyable
evening. But, we didn’t know a
thunderstorm was forecast …and right at one of the most exciting parts of the
movie, the lights flicker and go off. The lights would come back on, then flicker
and go back off. We didn’t immediately
try to find the spot where the movie had stopped, we waited to see if the
lights and electricity was going to stay on.
The angels didn’t likely know how long the intervals would be, or what
they were to expect next …but, the Light brought light to what was going to
happen next.
Then night came again
…& this repeated itself on day two & three. It seems a couple remedies
were also instituted so they wouldn’t be drenched, who really knows??
Yet, near day four, it
would seem to today’s child that light bulbs were placed in the night, so it
would not get so dark. And what was this
new kind of light in the day. Perhaps a bit confusing, and not noteworthy to
sing about …but, it was clear the next day. The angels may have hesitated in
song, but the birds celebrated as the earth rotated to reveal the sun.
The intervals of
darkness may have served as a reminder to the angels of the consequence of the
rebellion, I don’t know, but it seems the birds are a reminder to us …not of
the fact that we can trust the interval of light and dark each day, but that we
can be thankful for it, hearing the song at the dawn of each day.
There are those who’d
say I’m taking this too far, but I don’t think God finds it problematic that I
see wonder and beauty in what He has done, nor is it impossible to think that
He can instill us with understanding.
Though one thing I fully understand is that taking something too far can
be problematic, and I certainly strive to avoid thinking my understanding of
things is in any way perceived accurately.
On day 6, when the
Bible mentions that men & women were created, I believe many pairs were
created …and Adam created with them, alone. But, he was placed in the Garden, experiencing
a day with God, culminating with the creation of Eve.
When I was young, my
parents had one of those heavy floor model T.V. sets. It had many knobs. I can’t remember my own lessons, but I
remember watching my younger brothers as infants …being told not to touch the
T.V. knobs. Being told not to touch the
knobs was more or less instructing, not because of any real danger …but, it was
a real inconvenience if everything had to be fine-tuned and adjusted. But, learning not to touch those knobs was a
safe lesson, as the more important lesson would come a bit later …being asked
not to touch the stove knobs, and to remove the silverware before heating
something up in the microwave. Whether
dangerous , or not, learning direction, instruction, and obedience is a good
thing.
Adam was told not to
eat the fruit of a certain tree. I have put my lengthy thoughts down about that
in another section, mostly trying to build on my own understanding of Genesis
2-6 while trying to minimize misunderstanding.
I will not try to repeat those thoughts at this time.
I will now comment on
another beginning of sorts, after our Savior Jesus was crucified. The apostles were intensely involved in
missionary work, telling people about Jesus …and most of them also died
horrific deaths through being persecuted for doing so. But, they accomplished much before that
happened. And many churches were
formed.
Something quickly
happened though. Many problems arose in
those churches and even leaders were among those who went astray. The Apostle Paul wrote to many of those
churches trying to right the wrongs.
But, when the apostles died, there was a great struggle for power …and
the nation’s leaders and church leaders both compromised to an extent that
likely they thought would benefit themselves, each claiming their own
authority.
A person can claim to
hold a title, but it is of little effect unless there are those who accept them
and their title. Yes, there are many
factors that tie in with ruling, but I’m going to name two at this time: fear
& exclusiveness.
That child which I
mentioned earlier, who was instructed not to touch the knobs on the T.V., would
not be considered a bad child if he did play with the knobs. It is not like what the serpent told Eve,
that the only reason she was told not to eat the fruit was because if she did,
she would be as gods. Yes, the child may
see the parents, and even the older siblings touch the T.V. knobs …and perhaps
think he could be like them. But, the
child is learning …and we would likely agree that the child has not reached the
‘age of accountability’.
Yet, there seems an
element of fear involved in failing to meet the expectations of a hierarchy
list. I know of a situation where the mother was too weak after she gave birth
to attend the baptism of her baby. She
would have liked to attend, but in fear that the baby may get sick and die
before the baptism could take place, the mother missed the event she could have
participated in, only a week or two later.
It seems to be always
the case, that the mother is mostly the one to take the children to
church. So, if you want to grow, fear
and exclusiveness go hand-in-hand. You
get the child baptized as soon as possible.
Then when the child is beginning school, the child receives their First
Communion. The child is well on their
way, and though some faiths may think these are unnecessary, they certainly
wouldn’t be grouped as unhealthy things. Isn’t God supposed to be the central focus of our activities?
Well, when the child
is baptized, that child is considered of that faith, though the child has no
idea what is going on. Yet, the parent
is committing to guide the child through life.
Back in Europe during the Dark Ages (or Medieval Times) it was
difficult for a Mom …not that it is ever so easy. But, these times were
particularly troublesome. A Mom tried to
raise a good family, so she did the best she could. What she likely couldn’t do was read a Bible
(many people couldn’t read, but mostly there were no Bibles in their language
to read), so she had to rely on what religious leaders instructed.
When the Reformation
began, there were many more people saying what the Bible said, and also other
translations added to the controversy.
So, the organized church there should be only one translation, and one
church to interpret it. At the Council
of Trent, that translation was stated to be the Latin Vulgate, which just
happened to include a group of Books that had not been clearly accepted by the
church, Jerome himself calling them ‘doubtful writings’.. Those Books made up the Apocrypha, and the Council
of Trent in 1546 deemed them at this time as divine and not ‘doubtful’, and
further stated that whoever would not accept these Books (and the sacred
traditions of the church) “let him be anathema”
Those who feared the
leaders, or feared the leaders were correct with their teachings …often bought
indulgences. It was not beyond their
imagination to strengthen the coffers and kill the scoffers.
A century and a half
passed with mostly the sole guidance coming from religious leaders, too often
the dominant leaders serving their own lofty needs, not wanting people to read
a Bible, and burning translations people could read. People who did not agree with the elite
church leaders, were treated with the worst cruelty …at times, including
death. In England
Yet,
one should never try to justify an action, claiming it is not wrong, when it is
indeed wrong. One should not say Jesus
would be fine with something, when He clearly would not. Jesus told the men, who said they caught the
woman in the act (an act with a man, but there was no man to
condemn), that the one who was without sin should cast the first stone. Jesus
did not want them to cause harm to the woman, but He didn’t say what she had
participated in was okay. Jesus told her
to go, and sin no more. Jesus still called it sin.
Creationism
group on Facebook: It is God's righteousness that necessitated that Adam
be given a choice to obey ...thereby then not being evil, but a simple act of
disobedience. We all have freedom of choice, we are not robots.
You may think it strange, but I'm thankful for it. We all sin, and we don't have to feel like that separates us from God, it better puts things in perspective. I don't look at it as punishing Adam. God clothed them, a provision for their disobedience ...and the complete provision is Jesus.
With God being fair, each makes a choice to follow God, or not. Without the sacrifice of Jesus, we would likely have to have Satan around for forever. Curiously, (Lucifer/Satan) the serpent tempted Eve in the manner which he failed. Satan wanted to be like God, yet in his selfish way, he wouldn't at all be like God.
The other point is that God told Adam not to eat that one fruit, but it doesn't say He told Eve. It is clear to me that Adam told Eve what God had said, and perhaps Eve didn't trust Adam got it quite right.
Beyond knowledge is wisdom, and the heart of God (and by heart, of course, I mean the character).
As we read the Bible, we can see that God is concerned with all of us, and that relationship is key.
When I was in college, I was very much interested in studying evolution. It could be claimed that I didn't understand it, therefore I didn't stay on that direction of thought. But, I would not use that same logic to say a person has problems with the Bible because he/she doesn't understand God.
With anything, thoughts have to develop, but with the Bible, I found it is quite different in the fact that you can't 'just' read it. You have to be ready to read it. If you don't look at Him as a friend, then what motivation is there to try to understand??
God is about relationship, and I don't believe He set things in motion to watch them evolve ...then one day, suddenly, He felt things evolved far enough to the point He was going to hold one man & one woman accountable.
Satan's claim to Eve was that God was holding back. God did not hold back with Satan (Lucifer), and that didn't work out too well for Satan. Nonetheless, it was clever for Satan to tell Eve that God was keeping something from her.
Of course, there would be no progression for angels in evolution, unless one believes they are highly evolved species from another planet.
Everyone has the right to believe Moses was not led by God, and that 40 years in the wilderness was not enough time to write down what God had shown him. Everyone has the right not to believe in Noah, nor in the Flood account. Yet, Jesus did mention Noah …and the Gospel According to Matthew, Chapter 17, verse 3, mentions Moses.
You may think it strange, but I'm thankful for it. We all sin, and we don't have to feel like that separates us from God, it better puts things in perspective. I don't look at it as punishing Adam. God clothed them, a provision for their disobedience ...and the complete provision is Jesus.
With God being fair, each makes a choice to follow God, or not. Without the sacrifice of Jesus, we would likely have to have Satan around for forever. Curiously, (Lucifer/Satan) the serpent tempted Eve in the manner which he failed. Satan wanted to be like God, yet in his selfish way, he wouldn't at all be like God.
The other point is that God told Adam not to eat that one fruit, but it doesn't say He told Eve. It is clear to me that Adam told Eve what God had said, and perhaps Eve didn't trust Adam got it quite right.
Comment directed to Stephen Meiner: So it's not good to listen to God and it's not evil to listen to
Satan? That will surprise many Christians.
Stephen Meiner answers comment: I've tried to shorten my statements because people have said they
are too long, yet the very reason I make the statements long is to clarify, so
people don't think I'm saying something I am not.
But, you did ask the question, giving me the benefit of the doubt, so thanks for that.
Often we don't quite appreciate what we have until we no longer have it. And likewise, we often don't know how bad something can be until sadly we look for change. Some change is good, not all. If people are misdirected (as Satan did with Eve), if no change comes from accepting the misdirection, then what is to be learned. We are to follow God, or not.
Sometimes we can appreciate God more as we realize the mistake of turning away from Him. It's always good to listen to God, and we have the Bible to give us a quite thorough grasp of what that is. I don't see it quite as 'evil' that Eve listened to Satan ...she didn't know who he was (obviously, he used the serpent), and he didn't tell her he was a fallen angel.
Is there any other point that may surprise Christians? I am a Christian. After reading many of the comments on this 'Group' site, not much surprises me.
But, you did ask the question, giving me the benefit of the doubt, so thanks for that.
Often we don't quite appreciate what we have until we no longer have it. And likewise, we often don't know how bad something can be until sadly we look for change. Some change is good, not all. If people are misdirected (as Satan did with Eve), if no change comes from accepting the misdirection, then what is to be learned. We are to follow God, or not.
Sometimes we can appreciate God more as we realize the mistake of turning away from Him. It's always good to listen to God, and we have the Bible to give us a quite thorough grasp of what that is. I don't see it quite as 'evil' that Eve listened to Satan ...she didn't know who he was (obviously, he used the serpent), and he didn't tell her he was a fallen angel.
Is there any other point that may surprise Christians? I am a Christian. After reading many of the comments on this 'Group' site, not much surprises me.
Listed on a Facebook group site ‘Creationism’:
Supreme Being/God/Creator
You may believe in a multiverse or
an alternate dimension, but does anyone set forth the claim that they live in a
dimension other than earth, a dimension in which we comment on this site??
Being in a singular dimension, do
we humans exist here, having come into existence through a multiplicity of
ways? Or is there only one true way we came into being??
Creationists have their science and
often disregard or scoff at others. Evolutionists have their science and often
disregard or scoff at others.
Though we study much in the field of
science, there is something that doesn't follow science ...and that is a
Supreme Being.
The Egyptians had theirs, the Greeks
had theirs, the Romans had theirs, the Orient had theirs, and those in Africa or any other native people had theirs. And the MCU
(Marvel Cinematic Universe) has theirs.
We either believe in a Supreme
Being/God/Creator, or we do not.
If you don't believe in a Supreme
Being, then you don't ...and this post doesn't request a reason. If you do
believe in a Supreme Being, I'm sure you have your reasons why you favor what
you do.
Could you please list that which you
favor & why??
(Those who responded,
were mostly Mormon, or Latter Day Saints …and they gave testimony of their
religious experiences, and how the validity of those experiences led them to
the denomination of faith that they have.)
If I was going to
write a script for a movie on the first few Chapters of the Book of Genesis, I
could opt to not write any script at all, but just use what is in the
Bible. For factual information, this is
what I suggest. Yet, for a movie, people
also have to see something.
It’s okay if we read
of the serpent, and imagine on our own what the serpent looks like, as the
appearance is not so important. It is
the character, and what the character says …that is what is important. We know that Lucifer/Satan/the devil/the
serpent are one in the same. Yet, if we
do a movie about the serpent tempting Eve in the Garden of Eden, we are going
to bring our imagination to life. And we
use a bit of artistic liberty or license in doing this …and I am going to do
that very thing with what follows:
Lucifer wanted to be
like God, but not really like God …as Lucifer certainly wanted the status, and
to rule, but did not have the loving compassion. He certainly did not have contentment. So, how did Lucifer act when he was allowed
to roam about with the creatures God created?
Specifically, how did he react to the men and women God created? Would he attempt to influence them to go against
God, like he did with a third of the angels?
Certainly he would want to rule, but would he rule them to their
benefit, or his??
As God forms one more
man, Lucifer is interested in what God is doing. This one is also a man, and he appears like
the others …not powerful, somewhat inadequate, and for these reasons could be
even more easily persuaded than the third of the angels were.
But, God saw Lucifer’s
interest ---and even before He saw it, He knew of Lucifer’s past insatiable appetite to have what he didn’t
have, and his character was not so easily going to change ---especially because
he detested any sort of control over himself, and the consequences that brought
him here had only fueled his rage. Any
sort of restriction, even of a minimal nature, made him insanely driven to defy
that restriction. Yet, insanity that affects
a universe, with no thought of how it can affect the whole of creation …must be
held in check. It must be done. God tells Lucifer, “This one man, you cannot
touch. You cannot consume his thoughts with your treachery.”
God planted a garden
and put this one man in the garden …this Garden of Eden. And God also told this man there was one he
couldn’t consume …the fruit from one of the trees.
Adam’s failure was not
his deliberate intent. Eve had been
tricked …and perhaps Adam feared he was about to lose the very special
companion God had given him. On the
other hand, Lucifer always seems to look for a loop hole, trying to accuse God
of not being righteous. He could have
spent all his time with those outside the Garden of Eden, but he deliberately
wanted to do the most he could against God …and in this case, he felt he could
get to Adam through Eve. Lucifer was
right about this, but oh, so wrong about what it was all about.
(Yes, I believe many
men and women were created outside the Garden of Eden. And the statement about Cain marrying his
sister, stating that many brothers and sisters were born before Seth …well, you
could say ---though I wouldn’t ---that only sisters were born. It would be a
real insult to brothers born before Seth to hear their mom say at Seth’s birth,
“For God has appointed me another seed, instead of Abel …” I can’t see any mom saying that …and I
believe Seth was the third son. I think
they were devastated after Cain killed Abel, and didn’t have any children again
until Seth. And they were hopeful, but
likely were concerned how he’d turn out …and didn’t even call upon God until
they had hope and faith restored with the birth of Seth’s son.) { And I read over and over again that Abraham
married his sister, yet Genesis 11:31 clearly states Sarai is Terah’s
daughter-in-law, not his daughter.}
In the Book of Job,
Satan complained that Job had a hedge of protection around him. God allowed circumstances (directed by Satan)
to prove Satan wrong. It is likely that
Satan did not have permission to tempt Adam, yet there was clearly not that
restriction of Satan not tricking Eve. And Satan was out to prove something.
When Satan told Eve, “You shall not surely die …”, it is
Bible scholars who quickly point out that Satan was not correct because when
God told Adam, “ …for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely
die ….” refers to the beginning of death, or a spiritual sense of
death. So, when Eve ate the forbidden
fruit, she could have been referred to as the mother of all death. But, we see God gave them a covering to
protect their nakedness, in an act of restoration …and letting them see the
importance of all this, the vision of eternal life. All those who have this shared vision can
look at this as the beginning of living …and understand the relief Eve felt as
she understood she was to bear children, and instill in them the hope of
eternal life (the mother of all living).
God does not need to
prove anything, but it seems we are the ones (not just Satan) that often demand
proof. God decides when enough is
enough, and when Satan tried to test Jesus in the wilderness, Jesus would have
none of it.
And Satan was soon to
see what it was all about.
I
believe in the Bible, and the Person who God is, described there. Not everyone
understands all there is to understand on anything. But, I believe the Bible
gives us adequate knowledge.
Beyond knowledge is wisdom, and the heart of God (and by heart, of course, I mean the character).
As we read the Bible, we can see that God is concerned with all of us, and that relationship is key.
When I was in college, I was very much interested in studying evolution. It could be claimed that I didn't understand it, therefore I didn't stay on that direction of thought. But, I would not use that same logic to say a person has problems with the Bible because he/she doesn't understand God.
With anything, thoughts have to develop, but with the Bible, I found it is quite different in the fact that you can't 'just' read it. You have to be ready to read it. If you don't look at Him as a friend, then what motivation is there to try to understand??
God is about relationship, and I don't believe He set things in motion to watch them evolve ...then one day, suddenly, He felt things evolved far enough to the point He was going to hold one man & one woman accountable.
Satan's claim to Eve was that God was holding back. God did not hold back with Satan (Lucifer), and that didn't work out too well for Satan. Nonetheless, it was clever for Satan to tell Eve that God was keeping something from her.
Of course, there would be no progression for angels in evolution, unless one believes they are highly evolved species from another planet.
Many levels of good,
and many depths of evil exist in this world.
There is a 12 year old
girl. You may imagine she lives in
Africa, or perhaps in Iran
Sadly, she is not the
only 12 year old girl who feels this way, but she doesn’t know any other 12
year olds. And each day she suffers
alone as she is beaten and abused.
The only thing that
sustains her, is that the family dog gets beaten too. So, I guess she’s not
totally alone. And her mere purpose for
living is to comfort her dog each day, after being beaten nearly unconscious. On the rare occasions her dog can muster up
enough strength, she knows her companion just wants to run away.
She wants to help her
dog run away, but the one time she let her dog loose, Dad tried to chase it
into traffic. Her poor dog didn’t want
to run into traffic, it did everything it could to dodge the cars and
trucks. She admired her dog’s desire to
live.
Two years ago Mom
tried to run away with her. When they
were caught, he beat both of them badly.
Mom must have gotten the worst of it, because she didn’t live long after
that. Dad said he found her at the
bottom of the stairs when he got home.
That wasn’t true, but who is going to believe a 10 year old?
Dad had always ignored
the dog, but with Mom gone, it seemed that Dad really hated the dog …after all,
it was Mom’s dog. And that’s when her
only companion and friend, her dog, seemed to take the brunt of all of Dad’s
anger.
She wonders whether
all men are this way. Mom really loved
her, and she said their dog was a good dog …but, Mom said Dad was evil. She is ashamed to say it, but she wishes Dad
had died instead of Mom.
She often dreams that
there is a place where people can live without evil. Maybe there is such a place. Maybe it’s not just a dream. Do you share this dream, or share this
belief??
*******************************************************************************
Evelyn is unable to
sleep. She is used to sleeping alone
…that kind of goes with the territory, being married to a military man. You never quite get used to it, and the
emotions are rather complicated …not being with the one you love, the one you
are married to, that is.
It’s not an uncommon
question, yet every time she gets asked, it’s a bit unnerving. “Why’d you marry
someone who you knew would hardly ever be there?”
She doesn’t want to
answer in a way that makes her appear defensive or condescending. She holds back from answering, but thinks to
herself, “Because I care deeply for my country, and I have immeasurable respect
for anyone who serves.”
She’d been asked, “Why
don’t you serve?” A fair question for
today, as the lines are a bit blurred as far as roles go …women often demanding
their rights to be able to serve in any position or capacity. Yet, the only position that they alone can
serve in …is motherhood, and strangely that is the one role that so many women
don’t put much value in.
Everyone who knows
Evelyn, knows of the high regard she has for the military. Why doesn’t she serve in the military? She doesn’t have to answer …that question
will be visibly answered in a few months.
A few months ago, her
husband was granted a short leave. On
those few cherished days of rare occasion, she didn’t have to sleep alone. But, now that he’d returned overseas, technically
she was still not sleeping alone. Just
today she wholeheartedly received the news of a position she valued with equal
high regard as those serving in the military.
This welcoming news came in the form of motherhood.
Evelyn is uneasy. She is always concerned for her husband’s
safety, but she knows it is out of her hands …her only contribution being
praying hands. Yet, it suddenly is not
as easy to just let faith rule over her human emotions..
She loves her husband
so much, and now she is faced with figuring a way to tell him how she wants him
home at this time more than ever before.
Many children grow up without a dad, but Evelyn feels they shouldn’t
have to.
She tried reading, but
she didn’t know at all what she had read.
It didn’t matter though, a book was not going to solve her problem. Maybe a glass of milk will help. She’d read that it could help.
Evelyn drinks her
glass of milk in the kitchen, then goes back to the bedroom, turns off the
light, and gets back in bed. She looks
out the window for a moment or two, looking at the stars. Their soft twinkling light provides some
comfort, and she closes her eyes.
It is so quiet, she
can hear the wall clock ticking. Then
she hears a voice.
Voice: “Eve.”
She sits up in bed,
glances out the window at the stars again.
She knows she is awake.
Voice: “Eve.”
Evelyn is more
agitated than scared, “I don’t know who you are, where you are, or what you are
doing in my bedroom …but, you better get out!”
Voice: “I had permission
to be here.”
Evelyn: “I don’t know who you dreamed gave you
permission, but you only have permission to leave!”
She doesn’t know how
to respond. This can’t be a joke …it is
not funny, and it’s rather sick and disturbing.
That must be it …it could be a mentally ill person. It’s good she was a bit firm with her
response, but not to be perceived perhaps as too threatening.
Voice: “God gave me
permission.”
Evelyn: “No way did God give you permission to come
to my bedroom.”
Voice: “You’re right, of course …so, let’s go to the
kitchen and I’ll show myself. And we can
have a glass of milk together.”
Evelyn walks
cautiously to the door, and turns the light on.
Voice:
“I’ll be waiting in the kitchen.”
Evelyn clicks a number
she had listed on her iPhone, and says to herself, “And the police will be
waiting for you.”
She doesn’t know why,
but she cautiously walks to the kitchen.
She should have locked her bedroom door, and not worry about what he may
be doing next. Why all of a sudden this
surge of bravery?
When she gets to the
kitchen, a man is sitting there.
Man: “I thought I’d help myself to a glass of
milk, Eve. I know you already had a glass of milk a while ago, so you probably
will not want another. I don’t mind
drinking alone.”
Evelyn: “My name is Evelyn …not Eve. I also don’t mind drinking alone, sitting
alone, sleeping alone, or just plain being in my house alone. Actually, I prefer it. And you sitting there, do you realize how
creepy that is …how long have you been here?”
Man: “I know about lots of people. I know about
your husband too. Adam & Eve …so
kind of God to let me experience this again.”
Evelyn: “I told you that I’m not Eve …you must have
the wrong person, wrong house, and wrong part of history. In the Adam & Eve story, the only other
person besides God …is the serpent.”
Man: “I like that …you are very sharp. So, you guessed it, yes, I am the devil. And by the way, this won’t take long. It may seem long to you, but it won’t
be. I know you alerted the police, but I
will be long gone by the time they get here.
They can’t get me anyway. And you
should be thankful the State Police don’t as of yet need to pay you a visit
with news of your husband.”
Evelyn: “My husband?
What about my husband?”
Devil: “You’ll be hearing about it. They took him to a military hospital. He is very sick …and there is only one thing
that can save him.”
Evelyn: “God can save him.”
Devil: “I know you people, and how you speak of
being saved. I know your husband is
saved from where I’m eventually going, but I’m talking about saving his life
here on earth, with you. He is about to
die, and God agreed not to interfere.”
Evelyn: “Why would God agree to anything with you?”
Devil: “Well, you know we have a long history
together. And I was kind of attracted to
your Adam & Eve relationship. Who knows, maybe God wanted another whirl at
it too.”
Evelyn: “Long history together? I wouldn’t exactly call that a
friendship. And it’s Evelyn …not Eve!”
Devil: “No matter, God gave me permission.”
Evelyn: “I want to know about my husband.”
Devil: “I can take you to him.”
Evelyn: “I don’t want to go anywhere with you.”
Devil: “Sorry, this is the arrangement. God felt it is important. You know how God is with details. He insisted that you first see your
husband. And I don’t see any taxi
outside your house, waiting to drive over ocean water. Sorry, you’re stuck with me.”
Evelyn: “You keep saying ‘sorry’ …I didn’t think that
was in your vocabulary.”
Devil: “The way I use the word, it means I don’t
care.”
Suddenly, they are at
the military hospital.
Evelyn sees him,
“Adam!” and runs to her husband.
Devil: “He is unconscious. Even if he wasn’t, he wouldn’t know you are
here. No one can see or hear us.”
Evelyn: “Why is it important to God that I come here
…is Adam going to die.”
Devil: “I can’t imagine any possible way that he
will live. There is one chance that is
so remote that I don’t even consider it possible. But, you ask why God wanted you to come here
…well, it’s so you can tell I was telling the truth. I don’t exactly have a high credibility
rating with you Christians. Most of you
don’t trust me.”
Evelyn: “You think!?!”
Devil: “Now we must go somewhere else.”
Before Evelyn can
protest so quickly having to leave her husband’s side, they are standing beneath
a Mulberry tree.
Evelyn: “Now, why are we here?”
Devil: “Well, you know I was reminiscing about the
Adam & Eve thing. And I kind of
thought we could do the fruit thing again.
But, this time I will be in charge, so it will be a little different.”
Evelyn: “I’m not going to do the Adam & Eve thing
…for one thing, I told you I’m not Eve, my name is Evelyn. And furthermore, I know who you are, so it
won’t work. I’m not going to play your
cruel game.”
Devil (smiling): “Oh, you will play …and you will play by my
rules. There’s only one chance your
sweet Adam will live, and you’ll take that chance.”
Evelyn: “I can’t believe God would agree to this.”
Devil: “So, you are a nonbeliever now?”
Evelyn: “Don’t get excited, that’s not what I said.”
Devil: “Here’s the deal, whether you like it, or
not. Tomorrow one of God’s boring
‘yes-men’ angels will take your husband to this very tree. He will only be allowed to pick one mulberry
…and only one mulberry on this tree will save him.”
The devil points to
the one mulberry.
Evelyn protests: “There must be thousands of mulberries on
this tree, and the one you pointed to is almost out of reach …and it can barely
be seen, hidden behind those leaves.
That gives Adam virtually no chance at all. That’s not fair!!”
Devil: “Fairness?
Who do you think you’re talking to? You’re not amused, are you?”
Evelyn: “You’ve got to be kidding …how would you ever
imagine I’d be amused? I care about
people.”
Devil: “Before I take you back home, I have to ask
you if you have any questions. That’s
the part God insisted upon.”
Evelyn: “I have no questions. It is very clear what you are doing.”
Devil: “I’m doing not that much different than what
most people claim is their daily goal. I
try to enjoy each day. And I think it
makes for an interesting scenario. First
Adam & Eve are restricted from eating one fruit. Now, your husband has to eat one fruit. I
think I’m achieving my daily goal, don’t you?
You must see how much I’m enjoying this.”
Evelyn: “At someone else’s expense? The more someone suffers, the more gratifying
it is to you?”
Devil: “You are being rather accusatory …and you’re
sort of ruining this for me. One of the
Ten Commandments is: Thou shall not steal.
And you are stealing this moment from me. I think I’ll take you back now. The day is still young …and there are other
people I can mess with. You have to be
on the other side of the planet, so there is no chance you can help him choose
tomorrow. My rule is that you can’t tell
him anything. So, are you ready for me
to take you back home?”
Evelyn: “With Adam having to choose tomorrow, I’d
like to pray at this very place where he will be forced to make his fatal
choice.”
Devil: “Okay, but I’m sure you won’t mind if I wait
for you on the other side of that hill.
I don’t like to hear people pray.
Just hurry!”
Evelyn: “I don’t hurry prayers. And who are you trying to kid …you have
plenty of time, I’m sure.”
Devil: "But time is so precious ...I'm sure you agree. And speaking of time, you know I've been around for quite some time, so there's no trick that you'll be able to pull on me. I made specifications with my deal, so you would only be jeopardizing the only almost nonexistent hope you appear to be clinging to ...so, don't try to tie a thread, ribbon, or note to indicate that one mulberry because it is against the rules."
Evelyn: "It seems so against your nature to advise someone of rules. Now, if you can't bear to hear me pray, I'm going to start praying now."
The next day, the
devil insists that the boring angel and Evelyn meet at the mulberry tree. The devil is visibly upset.
Devil (addressing the
angel): “Hey, boring angel, you were
supposed to only allow Adam to choose one mulberry.”
Angel: “You may consider me boring, but long ago I
made a decision not to cheat or lie.
Even the seemingly trivial beginnings of such things, well, we’ve seen
what has become of that. You know full
well I didn’t cheat. I simply told Adam
he could only choose one mulberry.”
Devil: “Yeah, yeah …enough of that rigmarole. How do you explain this then?”
Evelyn: “If I may answer that question. A person does not have to pray with their
eyes shut.”
Evelyn opens her large
purse, which she had carried the day before …and it is filled with
mulberries. She opens her hand, and
there are three leaves in her hand. The
devil immediately knows that those are the leaves which were hiding the one
mulberry …and her purse explains how every other mulberry within reach was not
a choice for Adam, as they were not there for him to choose from.
Evelyn notices that
the angel is no longer there, and thankfully neither is the devil. She has enough mulberries to make a pie ...but the devil is obviously not interested in eating any humble pie, and she is thankful she does not have to share his company any longer. He can eat crow ...by himself.
Suddenly, the angel returns with a healthy Adam. Evelyn closes her eyes and gives him a big
healthy kiss, as they embrace.
When Evelyn opens her
eyes, she sees the stars twinkling outside her window. It had all been a dream. Well, not all of it …she is still carrying
her and Adam’s child, and that is a dream come true.
We assume the angels
had much freedom, and we know they had much power. Freedom to us means something quite different
…though we do have in common the same freedom of choice, in reference to God.
We humans have lots of
rules. It started out with one rule …not
to eat one tree’s fruit. As parents we
add many rules ourselves …guarding our children against dangers, that which
could cause them physical harm. But,
don’t we also teach them morality, and how to later become good citizens?
Do we also teach our
children about the Bible? Or do we
encourage them to imagine about God, or choose not to believe in Him at all?
_____________________________________________________________________
The twins enjoyed
their birthday together, like they had year after year. This happened to be their 90th
birthday. They reminisced about the
things they had done together through the years, but admitted that they could
no longer do those things. The only
thing they could do well was sit.
Their grandson had an
idea. He knew they both enjoyed
fishing. He told them he would drive
them to the lake, and launch the boat for them.
And they agreed.
It was not a large
boat, but it suit them well. It had an electric
motor with an easy start. So, off they
went.
It was a large lake …a
lake they knew well. The best fishing
was on the other side of the lake. They
were in a happy mood, sharing stories of fish they had caught in years past. But, their mood changed when they were half
way across the lake. Their motor stopped
working, and they couldn’t get it started again.
They were still happy
to be together, and their grandson would rescue them. They started to laugh
together …until they noticed a hole in their boat. The boat was taking on a substantial amount
of water, and their grandson had said he would be back in a couple of hours to
pick them up. Yet, they both knew that
by that time it would be too late. And
they had thought it unnecessary to wear or bring life preservers.
They both looked
around, seeing they were the only ones on the lake. It seemed unlikely that they would be saved.
What do you think the
two brothers did?? Do you think they
spend these last moments discussing how the hole got in their boat??
I agree, it would be
rather irrelevant how the hole got there.
They needed saving.
It is also a bit
irrelevant what happened before the events we read about in the first couple
Chapters of the Book of Genesis. Many of
us agree that the angels existed before that, and they would also have had a
habitation …whatever that place was where they lived. But, what is really relevant is what God has
given us as relevant …revealing to us what He feels we need to know.
What do we need to
know?? Well, it seems very important
that we know what many of us have failed to realize or know. Or perhaps we know, but neglect to live as if
it has significance.
Who is God??
Elohim, Adonai,
El Elyon, El Shaddai,
El Roi, Jehovah-jireh,
Jehovah-nissi,
Jehovah-mekoddishkem,
Jehovah-shalom,
Jehovah-saboath,
Jehovah-raah,
Jehovah-tsidkenu,
Jehovah-shammah …to
Name a few.
Who is God??
Our Creator, our Lord
The Most &
All-sufficient
God who sees & provides
Our banner who
sanctifies us
Who brings us peace in
a host of ways
Our Shepherd who
guides & protects us, instituted through His righteousness
Our God who is always there.
From the beginning of
Creation, the people had to learn this.
And let me add, that I won’t argue whether and to what extent the
universe was there for the angels, or whether they had Dino for their pet. I just believe it is relevant for us how we came into being, and how God did so much to
guide us and show us who He is …inclusive of an act which shows us the greatest
love we can know, in sending us Jesus.
And I don’t know how
anyone could read the entire Bible without knowing God loves them.
You can discuss if you
like how the hole got in the boat …but, the boat is still sinking. We need saving. You may tell me to put a cork in it …and that
was the answer to stop the boat leak.
But, for this life, Jesus is the answer.
Our relationship with
God is key, as was it for the angels.
But, the Bible is for us. It
should lead us to a better understanding of God, yet sometimes an overpowering
emotion can block that understanding, and because we cannot accept what we
perceive as an emotional intrusion, we also cannot accept He whom we choose to
disagree with.
Our relationship took
a turn when one fallen angel had an impact upon those who had just been
created, and God had anticipated this.
But, the Bible is not to guide the angels, it is meant for us.
The angels who
followed God, are mentioned briefly in the Book of Job 38:7 and Hosea 1:10 …and
are referred to as the sons of God.
Galatians 3:26 states, “For you are all sons of God through faith in
Christ Jesus.”
Also, are Romans 8:14,
Romans 9:26, and 2Corinthians 6:18.
There are also other verses.
The Creation that we
read about in the 1st Chapter of Genesis, is our beginning. Yet,
there does not seem to be just one beginning.
We get a hint of this in the Book of Revelation, with 6:14, stating,
“And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together …” & 21:1,
stating, “And I saw a new heaven and a new earth …and I, John, saw the holy
city, new Jerusalem coming down from God out of heaven …”. Could there have also been a departing away,
not just with angels departing from God, but also things departing from what
they had been, and the Creation we read about was our beginning, a wonderful
plan, at the turn of quelling the rebellion of a third of the angels??
I would think
‘Creationism’ implies Creation. If you
don’t believe in Creation, I know it’s popular not to, so you have much
company. And that would be a part of
this conversation.
Everyone has the right to believe Moses was not led by God, and that 40 years in the wilderness was not enough time to write down what God had shown him. Everyone has the right not to believe in Noah, nor in the Flood account. Yet, Jesus did mention Noah …and the Gospel According to Matthew, Chapter 17, verse 3, mentions Moses.
If I am going to
promote exegesis, then I must try my best to understand what the original
author meant, which is the definition of exegesis. Genesis 1:5 says, “ …And the evening and the
morning were the first day.” As difficult
as it is to control myself from inserting my own feelings, I must try to
understand what the author means by that.
What conclusion may I draw, other than it is speaking of one actual day.
At this point, you may
call me a YEC, as every additional ‘day’ also includes “the morning and evening
…”
Chapter 1, verse 27,
states that “God created”, so if I am to say that the humans evolved, I am
saying something that I believe which is quite different from what the original
author intended, as there is no mention of us humans evolving.
Chapter 1, verse 29,
says God gave them every tree with fruit to eat. If I am true in my attempt at exegesis, I do
not see a restriction from eating any fruit.
Chapter 2, verses 7
& 8 say that God formed man, and then God planted a garden. Continuing with
verse 8 & also looking at verse 15, both say God ‘put’ the man in the
garden, so I can scratch my head on this one, but I can only conclude the
author intended to say God ‘put’ man someplace where he originally was not.
Back to Chapter 1,
verse 20, mentions ‘fowl’ on the fifth day, and verse 25, mentions ‘beast’ on
the sixth day, at which time God said it was good. Then Chapter 1, verse 26, says, “And God said
…”, not I (Steve) said, and reading through verse 27, we read, “ …male and
female created He them.”
Yet, Chapter 2, verse
19, says, God formed the ‘beast’ and ‘fowl’ and brought them to Adam …”. Now, I must really scratch my head, in hopes
that I don’t dig too hard and hurt myself.
But, if I try not to scratch my head, but instead try to scratch beyond
the surface of what I read, I must conclude that the original intent of the
author was not to confuse me.
So, I must try to
understand. Is it too much to believe
what I read, that on the sixth day, God created men and women, but He selected
one man and put him in the garden?? And
is it too much to believe that the one man had one restriction (Chapter 2,
verse 17) that the other men and women (Chapter 1, verse 29) did not
have?? And after that, the one man was
given one companion in verse 22??
I’ve heard many
different people give different versions of what they feel this all means, but
I feel most of the beliefs come either from long-standing traditionally
established bad exegesis, or from no exegesis at all.
Isn’t the Creation
story in opposition to evolution? Isn’t
it really about whether a person believes the Bible, or not? And if a person doesn’t believe in the Bible,
then if they believe in God, isn’t that Supreme Being not He whom we read about
in the Bible??
Genesis 1:26, states,
“Let us make man (Adam) in our image …” The other references of man, verse
27, is a bit different (mankind).
A substantial number
of people say they believe the ‘us’
& ‘our’ speaks of the Trinity of
God. Yes, I do agree. (Though permission
is not needed …and they don’t need me to agree.) What I’d like to do is focus on the word
‘let’, beginning the sentence.
If I say to my family,
“Let us go to the beach today”, then a decision is put forth. Are we at the beach yet? No.
Chapter 1, verses 3,
6, 9, 11, 14, 20, and 24 also have the word ‘let’, but it seems like a command,
as God speaks things into existence.
But, in verse 27, the word ‘man’
is different, from what I read, “So, God
created man (mankind) in His own image …”
When God (verse 26)
said, “Let us make man …”, it seems to be referring to one particular man whom
God forms, and also places in a
special garden. We read of this man by
name in Chapter 2, after God gives him a commandment (to follow Him).
Of course, Adam then
names the animals.
If I plan something,
the plan starts in my mind, then I carry out tasks that prepare for the
event. When everything is set, my
attitude is, “Okay, let’s do this thing!”
But, back to the “Let
us make man …” statement. I believe that
God intended to make man at a certain point, even before He created the
angels. And of course, I understand that
God does all the things He intends to do.
But, the certain point in time doesn’t come until after the rebellion
and failure of a third of the angels, and Lucifer is sent to earth. So, it is when I read, “Let us …”, that I believe that time has come. And one man, Adam, set apart, was put in the
garden for the inevitable to happen.
My Dad said his dad
had a dog named Lindy. It seems God used
Lindy to accomplish something that the neighbors of a recent widow could
not. They had volunteered, but the widow
politely had told them no thanks. The
widow could sit down with a pail and milk the cows, but she did not have the
legs nor stamina to trudge all over the countryside to round up the cows. But, Lindy did that for her.
My dad said his dad
had wondered why Lindy was taking extra long in rounding up the cows, so he
took a walk to investigate. When he saw
Lindy was rounding up the widow’s cows first, he just smiled. Lindy was one of a kind …and set apart from
most dogs.
Adam was set apart
also. God had a purpose for Adam …to be
the first, in a line to Jesus. Adam
sinned, and we all do, but Adam was taught and accepted the teaching. Lucifer
took another form, but was true to form in what he did. It all fit the way God knew it would, and as
the accuser continued to tempt, deceive, and stir things up …a redeemer was to
come to set things straight, in the Name of Jesus.
A bit of a
summary: To parallel some of the events,
and reactions to those events, draws a clear distinction between Lucifer and
Adam.
Adam was told there
was one tree that was withheld from him, and it seems that just perhaps Lucifer
was withheld from Adam …therefore tempting Eve instead.
Lucifer was sent out
of his heavenly abode, and Adam was sent out of the Garden of Eden. We can only guess on much of this, but much
of it makes sense. Many people say that
Adam had never intended to disobey God, but since Eve was tricked, he didn’t
want to forfeit their relationship and leave Eve alone (and perhaps
himself). Yet, Lucifer acted much
different after his expulsion, and his act against God was much greater.
Yet again, God says
that sin is sin …and in His fairness, there was an expulsion for both. Adam may have tried to mention his
unsatisfactory reason, in fear that he’d lose Eve (“the woman You gave me”),
but it did not appear quite like a complaint to God, that he had been
emotionally ‘sold a bad bill of goods’.
Likely they could find little good that could come of this. But, Adam & Eve seemed to be grateful to
accept the remedy, understanding that they were not going to just die on the
spot. Likely death was explained to them
more thoroughly, and also how eternal death was different …and more importantly
what eternal life is (and it was only at this point that she was actually named
‘Eve’).
In contrast, Lucifer
(Satan) has continued to accuse God, and encourages people to go against
God. Lucifer (the devil/Satan) continued
his deceitful ways …as he did with giving Eve a very wrong impression of God.
More on that later
perhaps.
Now, let’s look at
some questions:
Oh, we’ve already done
that, I see. My Roman numerals: II-VI;
XIX-XXX; XXXIV-XXXVIII; & L-to just about here. And I forgot I mentioned something only 2
pages ago.
What I didn’t mention
was that ‘ha-adam’ referred to man or mankind …and without the ‘ha-‘, we merely
have ‘adam’ as a precise individual.
Genesis 1:26, stating “Let us make Adam …” & verse 27, stating that
mankind was created, male & female.
I believe the rest was mentioned, but I hadn’t mentioned this.
And Chapter 2, shows
how one man was ‘formed’ and life breathed into him.
“ …the universe cannot
have made more than a very small fraction of these possible proteins in the
time since the Big Bang.” How does
Stuart A. Kauffman explain how life came about?? Now, I could be wrong, as it
could be Thomas Nagel, or another (as I lost what I read, and late at night, so
maybe I shouldn’t have listed anyone’s name) …but, I did read an answer as
through selective advantage …every part of us came into being because
“organisms propagate above the level of atoms, and so, with them, do their
sustaining organs.”
You could say that
Facebook and Twitter exist because the internet exists. That would be a true statement, but also true
would be to say humans built the internet, and also Facebook and Twitter.
Speaking of selective
advantage, I would think a rock has an advantage in one respect because it
cannot die. You could say it can
reproduce by crumbling, making many more rocks …just smaller ones. Yet, a dune can grow by adding countless sand
size rocks.
I ask, what advantage
do atoms have in collectively producing something more complex than a dune of
sand, or a body of water. Do atoms seek
out to combine in like fashion, with hydrogen being like two parents who want
to have a child of oxygen??
Most life as we know
it needs water to survive, but does water need life, or does life need
water. And if water was here first,
would it out of necessity need to form unbelievably complex cells, each
containing an unimaginable functional arrangement of 100 trillion atoms.
If I pour water in a
glass, will the water need me?? I need
water, but if I find other water to drink and neglect that glass of water …the
water will just disappear out of the glass by evaporating into the air. We must then ask, does the air need the
water??
Does the air in Arizona prefer not to have much water in it, yet Florida Arizona
A forest fire needs
substance to burn. Do trees grow so a
forest fire can grow?? When I sleep at
night, if I get cold, will a tree grow faster than a tree can grow at my
bedside, so I can put another log in the fireplace??
And if life in its
simplest form began here approximately 4 billion years ago, would everything we
can imagine work together faster than what can even be conceived, to evolve
into such a variety of living things, so diverse and wildly different that even
atoms with brains and blueprints could not achieve the task in such a short
span of time??
You may think my
statement is ‘wild’, but along with an anti-entropic theory, it was mentioned
that a sense of consciousness at the lowest levels, yet still very significant
at perhaps atomic or even subatomic levels could explain how our world
advanced. It was clear that there was no
consideration at all that the God we read about in the Bible could have had
anything to do about why we are here.
Perhaps the book, A World Beyond Physics: The
Emergence & Evolution of Life (2019), was the book I was referring
to …and the theory of Constraint Closure.
Yet, the book I’d like to get this year is: The Mystery of Life's Origin: The Continuing Controversy (2020). The book includes an updated version of the
classic text The Mystery
of Life's Origin by Charles Thaxton, Walter
Bradley, and Roger Olsen, and new chapters on the current state of the debate
by chemist James Tour, physicist Brian Miller, astronomer Guillermo Gonzalez,
biologist Jonathan Wells, and philosopher of science Stephen C. Meyer.
There are many new and
challenging theories. To present them,
is exciting, and it sort of shows that you have knowledge that others don’t
have …when presenting the new so-called findings.
People may think,
“What’s so exciting about merely believing …as in, God just did it!?!” If we look at ourselves through our own eyes,
and our achievements …it may be a good feeling.
But, if we look at ourselves as God sees us, that may not make us feel
very good …especially, if we don’t know much about God, and how much He loves
us.
If we read the Book of
Judges, we see how people always seem to fall away, doing what is right in
their own eyes. It may not feel good to
think we are being judged. We can
accurately say the Bible states, “Judge not, that ye be not judged …”, but that
means we should not judge others, it does not mean that God does not judge
us.
Yet, if we realize
that we can follow Jesus, and we can be judged not by our sins, but through
repentance and His forgiveness …that would not give us a heart of fear, but a
heart to witness to those around us, sharing that wonderful truth.
Do you like to have
people who agree with you?? Or do you
know someone whom you always agree with??
Most of us like to
have followers. We have followers on
Facebook, we have followers on Twitter …and we also have a list of people we
follow.
Who do we follow??
Usually we follow
people whom we agree with, or who are somewhat like-minded.
Was it so bad that
Satan wanted followers?? Why was that
privilege taken away from him?? Of
course, we don’t know the full circumstances.
But, we can go by what
we do know.
This is an election
year. Presently, the Democratic
convention is taking place. And soon
afterwards, the Republican Convention will take place. In times past, there have been hecklers and
disruptors who have come to the conventions.
And usually they are people who support one of the two parties I’ve
mentioned. It seems that these
disruptors are not satisfied to attend their own convention.
On occasion people do
switch parties. Ronald Reagan was our 40th
President, a Republican, though in his earlier years he was a Democrat. Four years ago, Ohio
Should Satan be given
a second chance?? Like was said earlier,
he just wanted some followers, right??
First of all, it’s not
up to us to vote on whether Satan should be given another chance. But, God, who does make the decision, knows
how we think. And being that God wants
the best for us, in following Him …well, He wants to make our choice
clear. God has instilled in us justice (the
knowledge of what is right), and though sometimes we don’t seem to follow that
and perhaps even oppose it, righteousness is important to God. And He doesn’t want that aspect of His
character to be skewed, so we don’t see Him for who He is.
Why is that??
Well, God would have
it that none would perish.
God loves us.
So, would He allow
Satan another chance …even to go to Heaven??
Well, the way I read
it, Satan did have that chance.
Sometimes people refer to Heaven as Paradise . And sometimes people refer to the Garden of
Eden as Paradise . All we have to do is read of what Satan did
in the Garden of Eden.
I believe that when
God said, “Let us create …”, that He was making a clear point of creating men
and women outside the Garden of Eden, for an opportunity for Satan to have
followers and that in itself would show how he would treat those
followers. But, we all sin, and we don’t
always treat others well either. Yet, I
don’t believe that was the full point. I
believe it would be revealed whether Satan would be content outside the Garden
of Eden, or if he was more interested in causing trouble with the two which God
so intimately ‘formed’.
I believe it is beyond
just being merely wrong in my eyes, but terrible and tragic when people take
street drugs. I had a co-worker who said
her sister was living on the streets and addicted to cocaine. She loved her sister, and it was so sad when
her sister died on the streets …so young, and now many years ago. It is very tragic when someone does that to
themselves, and we should not just dismiss self harm by saying, “Well, they did
it to themselves.”
Aren’t their many
harmful things we do to ourselves, not as comparatively as bad as the example
that I just gave, but nonetheless harmful.
Yet, what if it is something comparatively as bad, but that we don’t do
to ourselves?? I’ve read that many times
in Russian history that poison was secretly administered to a political
competitor. The person didn’t willingly
take the deadly substance, it was done to them.
Does it seem less tragic because the political climate of our country
has done much to make us think Russians are bad, and therefore we don’t care as
much??
What if we knew the
person to be relatively good? Would that
make a difference?? And doesn’t goodness begin in the mind??
How about Satan going
into Paradise …to mess with the minds of Adam
& Eve?? The Garden of Eden was like
a sort of Heaven. Even the Tree of Life
that will be in Heaven, was in the Garden of Eden. Could Satan be trusted in Heaven?? Only God knows, and clearly the answer is
“No!!” Scientists like to read about
experiments. Would the evidence of the
Garden of Eden be enough to convince you as a scientist??
Many places on Earth
are horrifyingly brutal and violent.
Those victims would not look forward to an afterlife that has all the
elements of this life. Yes, inadequate
food and water and medical treatment add to a very unhealthy life, but many
times aid is not even allowed to come in, as a cruel dictator confiscates the
relief and leaves the people in oppression.
Clearly this is an example of leadership and power that is ruthlessly
savage, or connivingly devious and sadistic, or as described in the Book of
Genesis 6:5, which is not limited to any one form of oppression, “ …the wickedness of man was great in the
earth, and that every imagination of his heart was only evil continually.”
The Flood killed
nearly the entire human population …and that is terrible. But, what is more terrible is eternal
death. Unchecked, things were getting
wickedly evil …and those few who saw the evil as evil, had little hope. The Flood was not something to look lightly
upon, yet it was a salvation of sorts …saved out of destruction, and a new
start.
It wasn’t long before
a very wayward group of people were led by Pharaohs, and not far away were a
savage and vicious group called the Philistines. And God chose to lead His people somewhere in
the middle of it all. The Pharaohs did
not follow God, but knew of His power …and the Philistines were soon to find
out. There was much conflict and
violence. It was not a very nice time to
live. Would any of us want to go back and live during that time?? And if you did, would you want to stand in
allegiance to the Pharaohs or Philistines??
No, Heaven will not be
a mixed bag. There is no place in Heaven
for that kind of conflict. If God allowed leadership in Heaven other than
Himself, then Heaven would be just like Earth.
None of us deserve to be in Heaven …but, Jesus died at the hand of those
who oppose God, as well as those who were ignorant of what was going on. Yet, even those who were doubters or a bit
misled, must have seen how wrong it is to brutally treat a person with a
different idea than theirs. And to side
with those who not only beat, but kill others without any threat to their own
lives …that is clearly against God. The
only threat they felt was against their own prestige and power, or that they
had accepted the pathway to hate in their hearts.
That pathway is
becoming a paved road, leading to their own eternal destruction …against the
very One who has provided a Heavenly abode.
And on one can say that someone else is responsible for a person’s
actions today, or for what has happened in the past. To do that would be to align oneself with
those who crucified Jesus, not those who were grateful for what loving act He
submitted to for the salvation of anyone who embraces that love.
To repent, and join
God is His desire for your salvation, the heart has to enter first. And again, in referring to the heart, it is
not one of the many organs of our body, but a mind …which is actually directed
by the Holy Spirit.
Yes, it will be wonderful
to see the two-thirds angels, as the sons of God. And in being set apart, Adam as the first
human son of God. But, all of us who
believe are also sons and daughters of God.
The genealogies that we read about in the Bible shows where the
followers of God often did not follow Him, but ultimately in their heart held
that glimmer of following Him …and were open to seeing how He taught them in
spite of themselves. And that line of
believers was like a judgment line for Satan, from Adam to Jesus. And not to leave the women out, Eve was the
mother of eternal living …and her line to Mary, giving birth to Jesus.
It makes so much
beautiful sense to me, yet I feel a bit like the ecstatic evolutionist who read
of a new discovery or theory supporting his beliefs …and how beautifully it
ties everything together for him. The
difference is, his main excitement seems to be in science …and my excitement is
in seeing what I feel God has so beautifully shown me.
Yes, I know we can all
claim that …and either steadfastly accept tradition, or be all over the map
with our claimed ‘leading’. And fellow
Christians can get as upset about differing views with the majority of same
beliefs as they would with an atheist who believes nothing the same. Though that in itself does not seem reason
enough to abandon the joy of reading the Bible, in fear that other Christians
will reject what you believe or argue with you.
I believe that sincere Bible study with other believers, who each believe
in the authority of the Bible …well, it’s had a very positive impact in my
life.
Yet, again, I know
that there is always danger in some aspects of even the beginnings of sincere
study. We can all read the letters from
the Apostle Paul to churches which had quickly fallen into so many temptations.
It is a very delicate
path, and often paths look similar …making it difficult at times to discern
which path is the correct path. Is it my
own leading, an emotional path, or the Holy Spirit leading me?? If we beg to differ, it’s best to turn to Jesus,
where we agree.
Facebook ‘Group’ …‘Creationisn’: (shows how exhausting this can be - - -(by the way, a YEC is a Young Earth Creationist point of view.) I am not into labels, so I didn't make that one up.
I did not put down my abbreviations on the interacting Facebook Group site because I think mostly they are meant to be a bit insulting, but I have three groups of people that I'm going to mention here because if you've read this far (which I doubt you have) you are way too much on board with me and you deserve to be subjected to my humor.
1) Evolution And God Each Relevant ---If you believe in God and evolution, then it comes across sort of like a theist. And I wonder a bit what you believe God did?? Do you think God is disinterested, or was a bit bored?? What do you think God's motivtion would be for not doing more?? And if you think God is not actively invested in our lives, then how do you explain the circumstances that led to Jesus being crucified??
2) Science Explains While Evolution Reacts ---If you don't believe in God, then after this life on earth you must believe there is nothing. And since you feel you will be but a fleeting memory after you die, and you don't believe God is looking after things, then you must feel it's up to you to show a concern for future generations ...a huge monetary investment masked as Climate Change. You feel you have science on your side, and anyone who doesn't believe in evolution is ignorant ...often called a 'flat-earther'. You believe every creature evolved, and of course that has to include mankind. So, you can choose how you describe it ...as living creatures evolving out of a primordial soup, mud, or sewer (if you prefer).
3) God Reigns Employing Afterlife Terms ---If you believe in both claims of God and evolution, it shows an eagerness to get along, and only perhaps mildly offend. If you don't believe in God, then you believe all life came out of the primordial soup, or sewer. But, if you believe in God, as mentioned in the Bible, that does not make you a 'GREAT' person ...only God is great. But, a great way to live is to believe in Him who is great, and who offers a great afterlife.
Facebook ‘Group’ …‘Creationisn’: (shows how exhausting this can be - - -(by the way, a YEC is a Young Earth Creationist point of view.) I am not into labels, so I didn't make that one up.
I did not put down my abbreviations on the interacting Facebook Group site because I think mostly they are meant to be a bit insulting, but I have three groups of people that I'm going to mention here because if you've read this far (which I doubt you have) you are way too much on board with me and you deserve to be subjected to my humor.
1) Evolution And God Each Relevant ---If you believe in God and evolution, then it comes across sort of like a theist. And I wonder a bit what you believe God did?? Do you think God is disinterested, or was a bit bored?? What do you think God's motivtion would be for not doing more?? And if you think God is not actively invested in our lives, then how do you explain the circumstances that led to Jesus being crucified??
2) Science Explains While Evolution Reacts ---If you don't believe in God, then after this life on earth you must believe there is nothing. And since you feel you will be but a fleeting memory after you die, and you don't believe God is looking after things, then you must feel it's up to you to show a concern for future generations ...a huge monetary investment masked as Climate Change. You feel you have science on your side, and anyone who doesn't believe in evolution is ignorant ...often called a 'flat-earther'. You believe every creature evolved, and of course that has to include mankind. So, you can choose how you describe it ...as living creatures evolving out of a primordial soup, mud, or sewer (if you prefer).
3) God Reigns Employing Afterlife Terms ---If you believe in both claims of God and evolution, it shows an eagerness to get along, and only perhaps mildly offend. If you don't believe in God, then you believe all life came out of the primordial soup, or sewer. But, if you believe in God, as mentioned in the Bible, that does not make you a 'GREAT' person ...only God is great. But, a great way to live is to believe in Him who is great, and who offers a great afterlife.
Exegesis is reading the text as the
original author had meant to convey it, is it not?? I don't think I would ever
be as bold as to claim I can do that (with every verse I read).
It seems that me saying it 'could have been' is no more eisegesis than proposing the light on day #1 is the Earth's core. And all these evolutionary/science statements are basing a person's facts upon their science. When I read or quote scripture, of course I am making a theological point because that is what Creationism is to me. And I don't think my understanding of scripture is any more of a stretch than a lot of the science I read.
I have never intended to insult science here, and I appreciate everyone's science input. I will give an example. In describing my Dad, a person can say he fought in World War 2, worked in the garage at a car dealership, then was later a lab technician in a Veteran's Hospital ...and I will not argue at all about any of that. But, what I say about my Dad will be much different and much more than that. It would seem a bit odd or awkward if someone told me that it was just my opinion how I saw my Dad. Likewise, when I speak about God, or Creation, I see much of God's character. I do not speak of God in scientific terms, and I hope that doesn't offend anyone's study, commitment, or conviction of what they believe to be true.
Yet, it seems more offensive to some people that I believe in the Bible as being true. If not for the Bible, how could I visualize God?? Would I not just be making God to be what I wanted Him to be, if I just thought men wrote things down with no accurate representation of God??
It seems that me saying it 'could have been' is no more eisegesis than proposing the light on day #1 is the Earth's core. And all these evolutionary/science statements are basing a person's facts upon their science. When I read or quote scripture, of course I am making a theological point because that is what Creationism is to me. And I don't think my understanding of scripture is any more of a stretch than a lot of the science I read.
I have never intended to insult science here, and I appreciate everyone's science input. I will give an example. In describing my Dad, a person can say he fought in World War 2, worked in the garage at a car dealership, then was later a lab technician in a Veteran's Hospital ...and I will not argue at all about any of that. But, what I say about my Dad will be much different and much more than that. It would seem a bit odd or awkward if someone told me that it was just my opinion how I saw my Dad. Likewise, when I speak about God, or Creation, I see much of God's character. I do not speak of God in scientific terms, and I hope that doesn't offend anyone's study, commitment, or conviction of what they believe to be true.
Yet, it seems more offensive to some people that I believe in the Bible as being true. If not for the Bible, how could I visualize God?? Would I not just be making God to be what I wanted Him to be, if I just thought men wrote things down with no accurate representation of God??
I would think ‘Creationism’ implies
Creation. If you don’t believe in Creation, I know it’s popular not to, so you
have much company. And that would be a part of this conversation.
Everyone has the right to believe Moses was not led by God, and that 40 years in the wilderness was not enough time to write down what God had shown him. Everyone has the right not to believe in Noah, nor in the Flood account. Yet, Jesus did mention Noah …and the Gospel According to Matthew, Chapter 17, verse 3, mentions Moses.
If I am going to promote exegesis, then I must try my best to understand what the original author meant, which is the definition of exegesis. Genesis 1:5 says, “ …And the evening and the morning were the first day.” As difficult as it is to control myself from inserting my own feelings, I must try to understand what the author means by that. What conclusion may I draw, other than he is speaking of one actual day.
At this point, you may call me a YEC, as every additional ‘day’ also includes “the morning and evening …”
Chapter 1, verse 27, states that “God created”, so if I am to say that the humans evolved, I am saying something that I believe which is quite different from what the original author intended, as there is no mention of us humans evolving.
Chapter 1, verse 29, says God gave them every tree with fruit to eat. If I am true in my attempt at exegesis, I do not see a restriction from eating any fruit.
Everyone has the right to believe Moses was not led by God, and that 40 years in the wilderness was not enough time to write down what God had shown him. Everyone has the right not to believe in Noah, nor in the Flood account. Yet, Jesus did mention Noah …and the Gospel According to Matthew, Chapter 17, verse 3, mentions Moses.
If I am going to promote exegesis, then I must try my best to understand what the original author meant, which is the definition of exegesis. Genesis 1:5 says, “ …And the evening and the morning were the first day.” As difficult as it is to control myself from inserting my own feelings, I must try to understand what the author means by that. What conclusion may I draw, other than he is speaking of one actual day.
At this point, you may call me a YEC, as every additional ‘day’ also includes “the morning and evening …”
Chapter 1, verse 27, states that “God created”, so if I am to say that the humans evolved, I am saying something that I believe which is quite different from what the original author intended, as there is no mention of us humans evolving.
Chapter 1, verse 29, says God gave them every tree with fruit to eat. If I am true in my attempt at exegesis, I do not see a restriction from eating any fruit.
Chapter 2, verses 7 & 8 say
that God formed man, and then God planted a garden. Continuing with verse 8
& also looking at verse 15, both say God ‘put’ the man in the garden, so I
can scratch my head on this one, but I can only conclude the author intended to
say God ‘put’ man someplace where he originally was not.
Back to Chapter 1, verse 20, mentions ‘fowl’ on the fifth day, and verse 25, mentions ‘beast’ on the sixth day, at which time God said it was good. Then Chapter 1, verse 26, says, “And God said …”, not I (Steve) said, and reading through verse 27, we read, “ …male and female created He them.”
Yet, Chapter 2, verse 19, says, God formed the ‘beast’ and ‘fowl’ and brought them to Adam …”. Now, I must really scratch my head, in hopes that I don’t dig too hard and hurt myself. But, if I try not to scratch my head, but instead try to scratch beyond the surface of what I read, I must conclude that the original intent of the author was not to confuse me.
So, I must try to understand. Is it too much to believe what I read, that on the sixth day, God created men and women, but He selected one man and put him in the garden?? And is it too much to believe that the one man had one restriction (Chapter 2, verse 17) that the other men and women (Chapter 1, verse 29) did not have?? And after that, the one man was given one companion in verse 22??
I’ve heard many different people give different versions of what they feel this all means, but I feel most of the beliefs come either from long-standing traditionally established bad exegesis, or from no exegesis at all.
Isn’t the Creation story in opposition to evolution? Isn’t it really about whether a person believes the Bible, or not? And if a person doesn’t believe in the Bible, then if they believe in God, isn’t that Supreme Being not He whom we read about in the Bible??
Back to Chapter 1, verse 20, mentions ‘fowl’ on the fifth day, and verse 25, mentions ‘beast’ on the sixth day, at which time God said it was good. Then Chapter 1, verse 26, says, “And God said …”, not I (Steve) said, and reading through verse 27, we read, “ …male and female created He them.”
Yet, Chapter 2, verse 19, says, God formed the ‘beast’ and ‘fowl’ and brought them to Adam …”. Now, I must really scratch my head, in hopes that I don’t dig too hard and hurt myself. But, if I try not to scratch my head, but instead try to scratch beyond the surface of what I read, I must conclude that the original intent of the author was not to confuse me.
So, I must try to understand. Is it too much to believe what I read, that on the sixth day, God created men and women, but He selected one man and put him in the garden?? And is it too much to believe that the one man had one restriction (Chapter 2, verse 17) that the other men and women (Chapter 1, verse 29) did not have?? And after that, the one man was given one companion in verse 22??
I’ve heard many different people give different versions of what they feel this all means, but I feel most of the beliefs come either from long-standing traditionally established bad exegesis, or from no exegesis at all.
Isn’t the Creation story in opposition to evolution? Isn’t it really about whether a person believes the Bible, or not? And if a person doesn’t believe in the Bible, then if they believe in God, isn’t that Supreme Being not He whom we read about in the Bible??
Yes, the Bible is written by men ...Moses, a
man; David, a man; Solomon, a man; Matthew, a man; Mark, a man; Luke, a man;
John, a man; Paul, a man. While Jesus walked this earth as man ...He quoted
much of the Old Testament. Many very different religious denominations have
virtually the same translation, as there were sincere men who put much into it
to not lose its message in truest from as possible. I see that Solomon was just
quoted, who is a man, and that translation is here being used to support a view
...of which, again, men have chosen to include here. I do understand that this
debate has been going on way before any of us were born, and it should in no
way totally define us. Yet, I do believe God loves us so much, He wants us to
get to know Him ...and I believe the Bible is what we should look at.
Since Eve was told she was going to die upon
eating the fruit (of course, contradicted by the serpent) ...I'm sure when God
reconciled her and Adam, eternal life was explained to them, which is truly the
important aspect of life ...and following He who she then was reconciled to,
would definitely make her the mother of all living, and everlasting hope.
Yes, we do get tangled within
'possibilities' ...and I was not suggesting a 'contradiction'. God's Word is
not intended to confuse, it's we who tend to confuse. And I try not to
enlighten myself beyond the beauty of what God has for us.
I see a couple people (including you, thanks) mentioning YHWH, and yes, it is all about relationship. Two groups created for this purpose specifically ...sons of God, whether it refers to those who shouted for joy (Job 38:7), or accept Jesus (Galations 3:26).
I see a couple people (including you, thanks) mentioning YHWH, and yes, it is all about relationship. Two groups created for this purpose specifically ...sons of God, whether it refers to those who shouted for joy (Job 38:7), or accept Jesus (Galations 3:26).
That
seemed to be the end of another thread, but here is another, when I joined the
conversation :
Do we believe that some things evolved,
all things evolved, or no things evolved??
I am not going to mention everything, but I don't believe man & woman evolved. If I were to believe that, then Adam & Eve, Cain and Abel, and Noah makes no sense ...the first ten chapters of the Bible would seem rather unimportant.
Do we believe in Abraham ...and why, if not the others?? Do we believe in Moses?? Where do we begin to believe what we read??
Do we say the Bible isn't true, inclusive of what it says about Jesus?? Matthew 17:3 says Moses appeared to them. Many people believe Jesus was involved in Creation, "Let us ..." So, I'm not going off topic when I mention Jesus.
It's fine if your hobby includes studying how plants evolve, how bats evolve, and how cats evolve. Your study keeps your mind active, and you overall in better health. But, as far as my spiritual health ...the Book of Genesis, and Creation has deep meaning for me.
It doesn't offend me if someone says they believe I evolved, as they are saying they did too. But, when I look at God's overall plan for salvation ...I like to say that is for you too. And that begins in the Creation described in the first Chapter, "Let us ..."
Salvation does not require that we interpret those Chapters correctly, and I don't believe we have to agree that Jesus was involved in Creation. But, I think it's important that we believe He sacrificed for our sake.
I am not going to mention everything, but I don't believe man & woman evolved. If I were to believe that, then Adam & Eve, Cain and Abel, and Noah makes no sense ...the first ten chapters of the Bible would seem rather unimportant.
Do we believe in Abraham ...and why, if not the others?? Do we believe in Moses?? Where do we begin to believe what we read??
Do we say the Bible isn't true, inclusive of what it says about Jesus?? Matthew 17:3 says Moses appeared to them. Many people believe Jesus was involved in Creation, "Let us ..." So, I'm not going off topic when I mention Jesus.
It's fine if your hobby includes studying how plants evolve, how bats evolve, and how cats evolve. Your study keeps your mind active, and you overall in better health. But, as far as my spiritual health ...the Book of Genesis, and Creation has deep meaning for me.
It doesn't offend me if someone says they believe I evolved, as they are saying they did too. But, when I look at God's overall plan for salvation ...I like to say that is for you too. And that begins in the Creation described in the first Chapter, "Let us ..."
Salvation does not require that we interpret those Chapters correctly, and I don't believe we have to agree that Jesus was involved in Creation. But, I think it's important that we believe He sacrificed for our sake.
//the exact opposite point be
argued\\ ...would that be saying they'd be unimportant if they were true??
Thanks for bringing up this point. I'm saying, if man (& woman) evolved ...then when do we believe the accountability comes into play??
Sure we have countries and cultures that are arguably not as advanced, and Jesus said that to whom much is given much will be required ...but I believe all the people were rather intelligent (if not wise). Genesis 4:21 & 22, shows a very capable people. This does not appear to me as what one would call a parable. It does not teach anything, other than teach us that we need to consider this in our perception of how we view these people.
When I say it would be unimportant, I'm saying that I can get a good message from a fairy tale, which many people think the Bible is ...and it would not be important that I read the Bible as long as I have Aesop.
Some people think the story of Satan is a fable. Yet, he is a big part of the story in the first few Chapters. What was set up in Chapter 2, I believe was as much a test for Satan as it was for Adam.
If we believe in Satan, then we believe he will be judged ...not be messing up Heaven like he's worked so hard to do on earth. And if you believe the Book of Job just to be a fictional story, it would only serve to scare kids so they couldn't sleep at night. But, I see someone (Satan) who is not happy if someone is living a happy life and/or is successful.
Some people believe Hell is not real, yet for those living a horrifying life here on earth, they wouldn't want Heaven to be just like Earth ...which it likely would be if Satan were there. But, this also is dependent upon whether people believe in an afterlife.
If you or I don't get the science right, I don't think God looks to critically upon that. He looks at our heart.
Thanks for sharing.
Thanks for bringing up this point. I'm saying, if man (& woman) evolved ...then when do we believe the accountability comes into play??
Sure we have countries and cultures that are arguably not as advanced, and Jesus said that to whom much is given much will be required ...but I believe all the people were rather intelligent (if not wise). Genesis 4:21 & 22, shows a very capable people. This does not appear to me as what one would call a parable. It does not teach anything, other than teach us that we need to consider this in our perception of how we view these people.
When I say it would be unimportant, I'm saying that I can get a good message from a fairy tale, which many people think the Bible is ...and it would not be important that I read the Bible as long as I have Aesop.
Some people think the story of Satan is a fable. Yet, he is a big part of the story in the first few Chapters. What was set up in Chapter 2, I believe was as much a test for Satan as it was for Adam.
If we believe in Satan, then we believe he will be judged ...not be messing up Heaven like he's worked so hard to do on earth. And if you believe the Book of Job just to be a fictional story, it would only serve to scare kids so they couldn't sleep at night. But, I see someone (Satan) who is not happy if someone is living a happy life and/or is successful.
Some people believe Hell is not real, yet for those living a horrifying life here on earth, they wouldn't want Heaven to be just like Earth ...which it likely would be if Satan were there. But, this also is dependent upon whether people believe in an afterlife.
If you or I don't get the science right, I don't think God looks to critically upon that. He looks at our heart.
Thanks for sharing.
I agree. Too bad 'right &
wrong' is so blurred. I just read an article by Dear Abby (Jeanne Phillips)
...and the person writing Dear Abby said "I did nothing wrong" and
"I feel beaten down at every turn" as she was sleeping with three
different guys. And Jeanne agreed "you did nothing wrong", "quit
allowing yourself to be beaten down".
Multiple wives ….wives involving
incest. I worked in a Mental
Institution, and not following God’s plan for us with relationships works its
way into some very unhealthy and very unstable critical mindsets. I’ve seen many of the results. So, I don’t believe God used incest. It isn’t just physically unhealthy …it is
emotionally unhealthy and immoral. If
there was a drug to make it physically safe …it would still be horrific.
I've already thoroughly given my opinions (and reasons) why I believe incest was not involved within the family unit of Adam & Eve and children. I believe there were people outside the Garden of Eden, and with that in mind, I am giving my thoughts on what we read about Cain.
In
Chapter 4, we read that Cain killed his brother, Abel. As a result of that, God told Cain that he
was to be a fugitive and a vagabond.
Cain
told God that his punishment was more than he could bear, that this day God has
driven him out …and as time passes, anyone who finds him could possibly kill
him.
But,
God told Cain that if anyone kills him, vengeance will be taken on that person
sevenfold.
So,
how did Cain react??
And
how did Cain impress the people he came in contact with??
If
someone was going to kill Cain, they likely would not be deterred by a ‘mark’
they did not understand, and they would have to believe that the condition of
vengeance upon them would be carried out.
I don’t know how God communicated with people back then …especially
those who don’t seem to follow Him, yet do believe at least to the degree of
fearing some consequences.
Before
the Flood, inclusive of that sort description of Cain’s experiences in Nod, we
have a hint of the people’s knowledge of God, but very little. I will discuss that ‘very little’
understanding in the following paragraphs.
Well,
it seems Cain and his offspring were very intelligent and talented. It seems that Cain was somewhat comforted by
God’s statement of the consequences if someone wanted to kill him, and he
didn’t seem to fear people any longer, as he didn’t hide …he built a city and
named it after his son.
Very
likely they were impressed with Cain, and he had no reason to fear.
Cain’s
offspring were very musically inclined, and also instructed others in the
production and formation of brass and iron …tools, instruments, and all sorts
of useful creations.
It
is rather clear that Cain told the people (at least) that he had killed
someone, and that he would be avenged sevenfold if someone killed him; as
clearly several generations afterwards, Lamech said (Chapter 4, verse 4) that
he killed, and voiced his own devised mercy he felt should be allotted to him,
as he feels somehow his killing should be overlooked. We know Cain was not justified at all, we
don’t know Lamech’s scenario.
My
impression, whether it’s accurate or not, is that Lamech felt Cain got away
with something, and he felt he should also.
And it didn’t seem to me that he was voicing his great understanding of
God’s mercy.
God
makes it known who He is, and even today, we should know …actually, even more
today we should know, as we have the Bible to learn from, with the experiences
to read about to teach us.
In
living our lives, ‘why’ do we respond as we do?? And to what degree do each of us turn to God
while responding to everyday circumstances??
Whether
it was before the Flood, or after all the confusion at the tower of Babel Egypt Egypt
In
Chapter 20, the now named Abraham, travels to where Abimelech was king. And Abimelech had a conversation with God in
a dream, absolutely believing the dream and acting upon it.
What
do we believe and act upon??
Is
it fear only??
The
fear of God is the beginning of wisdom …but, what is the furthering of it??
I
was once told that glorifying God is giving a correct view of who He is, so
reading the Bible tells us much about relationship …and how we go wrong, yet
how He loves us in spite of ourselves.
Yes,
I believe the furthering of wisdom is realizing God’s love for us. And I don’t know how we cannot see this …so
fully shown to us through the sacrifice of Jesus.
********************************************************
My
response to the Book of Genesis being copied from other older stories:
Intense amount of work
there, Alex. The last time I read something that referred to 'P' & 'J'
...maybe Josh McDowell, I don't remember. Yes, you warned us it would be long
...was thinking about 'P' & 'J' (peanut butter & jelly) by the time I
finished.
I just wondered, if so much of the Old Testament is
not correct, then why didn't it concern Jesus, or why didn't He feel a need to
correct it?? Did He feel we were not mature enough to handle the truth?? Or did
He not feel it was relevant to His mission??
If Jesus knew it was going to cause us so much
conflict (which I believe He did know) ...then wouldn't He just tell us we
evolved, if we did, and not burden us with the story of Adam & Eve?? Or
burden us with the guilt of sin??
My Dad was in the Pacific during World War II, and
though he doesn't like to talk about it much, when he does ...I believe he is
telling the truth, not just some story he feels would benefit me more. Of
course, that's just me thinking again.
Thanks again!!
*******************************
Just another note by me …it
seems many people are saying that the Epic of Gilgamesh is older than the
Genesis account in the Bible, and that the author of the Bible account of the
Flood borrowed its story from a much older Epic of Gilgamesh. Let me answer that …
After the Flood, Noah
likely died before the Tower of Babel, but all three of his sons lived much
after their dad’s death …likely all living at the time of the Tower of Babel,
and also during the time the Epic of Gilgamesh was written. So, let’s make that clear …all three sons who
were all in the ark, and having witnesses the Flood, were alive to tell of the
Flood. And the Epic of Gilgamesh was
translated into many languages, of which were confused at the event of the Tower of Babel
We pick up the story with
Abraham –to Isaac –to Jacob (Israel )
–to Joseph (into Egypt ) –and
to Moses (out of Egypt
God directed Moses
throughout the 40 years of wandering in the desert after crossing the Red Sea . And much
was directed through Moses, whether officially written down at that time as
dictated by God, or whether in some written form that was later gathered and
compiled. And once again, Moses didn’t
have to understand everything, it was clear that God understood what He wanted
them to know and be directed by.
So, to say Moses didn’t
understand because he didn’t have the science we have today is rather ludicrous
to me. There is no science that baffles
or confuses God.
The greatest confusion is
when we don’t believe what was clearly given to us. God spoke to Pharaoh (Genesis 12: 10-20), and
to Abimelech (Chapter 20: 1-7), both who feared God though they did not follow
God. How much more would we think that
God spoke to those whom did choose to follow Him?? And yes, we read of that also …speaking to people directly, or through prophets.
And culminating with Jesus walking the earth, and speaking to thousands.
